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  Done with "core" Java , but now...  (Read 1598 times)
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Offline BluWingedOlive

Senior Newbie





« Posted 2014-03-14 12:16:40 »

My situation : hobbyst developer with some prior experience ( C# XNA) , cover to cover these books  :
1) HF Java
2) The terrifying 1300 pages brick : "Introduction to Java programming" by Y.Liang
The problem : now i'm facing things like  building ,deploying , xml  , Maven , Ant , etc..etc..
and i find all this stuff incredibly boring.
My question : i have to resign  and dive into these icy waters , or i can somehow avoid this punishment ?

Thanks a lot for any tip !
Offline Gibbo3771
« Reply #1 - Posted 2014-03-14 12:57:59 »

Building and deploying, it is also crucial you learn how to configure your IDE. Do it.

As far as I'm concerned, learning XML and stuff is something I will do when the need for it arises, so far I've been using json.

"This code works flawlessly first time and exactly how I wanted it"
Said no programmer ever
Offline dot_Sp0T

Senior Newbie


Medals: 1
Exp: 4 years



« Reply #2 - Posted 2014-03-14 13:08:57 »

It depends on you wanting to close the gap between being a hobbyist or being a programmer.

Building, deploying, etc. are as already stated a crucial part of development and sometimes can take up the same amount of time as pure development.

For comparison: If you build model ships you neither just start with a piece of wood and some glue but you start by planning it out and preparing tools.

EDIT: In the end using tools such as maven or ant allows you not having to bother with building a jar, writing the manifest, signing it and so forth as the tool does it for you. So, write one script an reuse it
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Offline Roquen
« Reply #3 - Posted 2014-03-14 13:32:42 »

Your average hobbiest Java programmer doesn't need to bother with any of that crap.
Offline JVallius
« Reply #4 - Posted 2014-03-14 19:13:59 »

Learn what you need to. Do things and if you hit an obstacle, learn it. You do not have to know everything immediately.

Offline opiop65

JGO Kernel


Medals: 156
Projects: 7
Exp: 3 years


JumpButton Studios


« Reply #5 - Posted 2014-03-14 19:16:07 »

That's good advice (JVallius). I think too many people try really hard to learn everything they can as quickly as possible and then burn out. Programming is an odd thing, you have to get into the mindset and then it will come a lot easier. The first few months are crucial as you will develop habits that you will (most likely) keep for the rest of your career unless you actively try to break them.

Offline JVallius
« Reply #6 - Posted 2014-03-14 19:31:27 »

I have studied design patterns in school. But when I needed them in my work, I had to learn them again. I do not say that learning them at school was a waste of time but you need to refresh your memory anyway if you do not use regularly the things you have learned. It is good to know that things exists, but learn them deeply only when you really need them.

Offline Roquen
« Reply #7 - Posted 2014-03-14 19:39:10 »

Learn what you need to. Do things and if you hit an obstacle, learn it. You do not have to know everything immediately.
Exactly.  And there's no point in learning today's tool if you don't know it because by the time you need it there's probably a new one...better! strong! faster!  Da-dah-Dah-da-dah!

I have studied design patterns in school.
I'll keep my mouth (mostly) shut.  Wink
Offline JVallius
« Reply #8 - Posted 2014-03-14 20:04:39 »

Quote
I'll keep my mouth (mostly) shut.  Wink

No, please, share your thoughts.


Offline Roquen
« Reply #9 - Posted 2014-03-14 20:06:02 »

Semi-inside joke.  I'm very anti-design patterns...I consider them harmful.
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Offline JVallius
« Reply #10 - Posted 2014-03-14 20:12:24 »

Semi-inside joke.  I'm very anti-design patterns...I consider them harmful.

Yeah I have not needed most of them, especially in game development. Singleton is the only one I have used so far. Maybe they have more place in business world.

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 823
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #11 - Posted 2014-03-14 20:50:47 »

I can appreciate design patterns... in 3rd party code.

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Offline CommanderKeith
« Reply #12 - Posted 2014-03-14 23:20:30 »

The problem : now i'm facing things like  building ,deploying , xml  , Maven , Ant , etc..etc..
and i find all this stuff incredibly boring.
My question : i have to resign  and dive into these icy waters , or i can somehow avoid this punishment ?
Thanks a lot for any tip !
I find maven and ant so idiosyncratic and clumsy. Why must they be programmed in XML rather than the language we already know: Java?
Luckily, If you use an IDE then it will do everything for you automatically. Another cool option is something that the jgo user Nate made:
https://github.com/EsotericSoftware/scar

Offline dot_Sp0T

Senior Newbie


Medals: 1
Exp: 4 years



« Reply #13 - Posted 2014-03-15 10:05:44 »

The problem : now i'm facing things like  building ,deploying , xml  , Maven , Ant , etc..etc..
and i find all this stuff incredibly boring.
My question : i have to resign  and dive into these icy waters , or i can somehow avoid this punishment ?
Thanks a lot for any tip !
I find maven and ant so idiosyncratic and clumsy. Why must they be programmed in XML rather than the language we already know: Java?
Luckily, If you use an IDE then it will do everything for you automatically. Another cool option is something that the jgo user Nate made:
https://github.com/EsotericSoftware/scar


Actually that one's easy to answer:
 They are programmed in Java. It's just that the primary way of using them is via an XML script.
As for ANT (and Maven, though Maven makes it a little bit more complicated): You can call any ANT Task from Java code as well if you prefer to, I tend to use some of them for stuff such as running Shellscripts as the ANT Tasks already are heavily optimized and tested.
Offline BluWingedOlive

Senior Newbie





« Reply #14 - Posted 2014-03-15 13:06:21 »

Thanks again : really nice people here around !  Smiley
I will start to learn the basics of  Eclipse.
Offline lcass
« Reply #15 - Posted 2014-03-17 16:06:13 »

So the proceedural generation is it somewhat random. What I would do for the object is list some component shapes and connectors that can be "stretched". You could apply set rules to when using the components this would create more natural modular stations.
Offline loom_weaver

JGO Coder


Medals: 17



« Reply #16 - Posted 2014-03-17 19:52:38 »

Thanks again : really nice people here around !  Smiley
I will start to learn the basics of  Eclipse.

A reasonable start.  Once you are comfortable with Eclipse I highly recommend learning how to craft and build a simple project on the command-line using ant.  ant is pretty much Java's version of C/C++ make.

It's good to know what's going on under the hood and if you ever want to distribute your project and/or share code with other developers you'll have to know how to package it up so that someone else can consume it.
Offline Nate

JGO Kernel


Medals: 153
Projects: 4
Exp: 14 years


Esoteric Software


« Reply #17 - Posted 2014-03-17 22:28:37 »

A lot of the crap that is popular is crap. Avoid what you like, especially if you aren't being paid/forced to use the crap. It takes a lot of experience to be able to tell if something is crap though.

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

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Medals: 823
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #18 - Posted 2014-03-18 06:21:51 »

Well, XML is a bloody red flag.

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Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 409
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #19 - Posted 2014-03-18 09:39:44 »

Don't I know it Cheesy

Cas Smiley

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