Java-Gaming.org    
Featured games (81)
games approved by the League of Dukes
Games in Showcase (495)
Games in Android Showcase (114)
games submitted by our members
Games in WIP (563)
games currently in development
News: Read the Java Gaming Resources, or peek at the official Java tutorials
 
    Home     Help   Search   Login   Register   
Pages: [1]
  ignore  |  Print  
  building my own computer  (Read 4155 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Offline NexusOne

Junior Member




Java games rock!


« Posted 2004-04-14 18:43:31 »

up til this point i've been programming on my laptop, which is only a year and a half old, but with significant limitations such as 256 mb of ram, and cramped for hard drive space, so im thinking of building a desktop pc. can anyone give me advice on whether its worth it, and if so where i can get good parts?
Offline ChrisM

JGO Coder


Medals: 3
Projects: 1
Exp: 14 years


Luke...END OF LINE


« Reply #1 - Posted 2004-04-14 23:43:23 »

It is worth it and NewEgg.com is the only place I would buy online from Smiley

-ChrisM

Offline cfmdobbie

Senior Member


Medals: 1


Who, me?


« Reply #2 - Posted 2004-04-15 10:31:48 »

/me is building a new computer when Doom 3 comes out, and not before!

Hellomynameis Charlie Dobbie.
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline duncanIdaho

Junior Member




invert mouse


« Reply #3 - Posted 2004-04-15 17:00:36 »

I *almost* built a new computer recently, but I choose to wait.  Here are the specs and then my reasons for waiting.
1  
2  
3  
4  
5  
6  
7  
8  
9  
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
Case: Lian Li PC-65 PC Case w/ 480W or higher name brand PSU - $191
Processor: Athlon 64 3400+ Retail - $423
Cooling: Retail Heatsink/Fan - $0
Motherboard: ASUS K8V Deluxe - $139
Memory: 2 X 512-MB Corsair TwinX XMS DDR400/PC3200LL - $249
Hard Drive: Western Digital 250 GB 7200RPM SATA - $212
Video Card: ATI Radeon 9800 Pro- $421
Sound Card: SoundBlaster Audigy Platinum 2 ZS Retail - $166
Speakers: Logitech Z-680 5.1 - $284
CD-ROM/DVD-RW: NEC 8X DVD+RW/-RW ND-2500A OEM - $121
CD-RW: Lite-On 52x32x52 CD-RW LTR-52327S - $33
Mouse: MSFT Explorer - $30
Keyboard: Microsoft Natural Multimedia Keyboard - $20
Operating System: Windows XP Pro - $134
Total: USD 2423

It's been years, so I was going all out.  I've decided to wait a bit for three reasons:
  • DDR2 compatible mobos
  • PCI Express compatible mobos
  • BTX form factor
That's three big changes set to hit the market any days now.  Will I buy DDR2 memory?  No.  Will I get a PCI Express Graphics card?  Maybe!  Do I want a motherboard that is ready to upgrade to that stuff?  Definitely.
I'd love to hear opinions on this.  I really need a new machine at home and I'm trying to draw the line between upgradable and not-worth-waiting for.
Offline abies

Senior Member





« Reply #4 - Posted 2004-04-15 17:23:58 »

I would suggest going for GeForce 6800 instead of Randeon. It seems to be a real deal in high price range - a lot more capabilities in shader front and 2-3 times faster for most games...
http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040414/index.html

Artur Biesiadowski
Offline Jens

Senior Member




Java for games!


« Reply #5 - Posted 2004-04-17 13:46:07 »

Quote
I would suggest going for GeForce 6800 instead of Randeon. It seems to be a real deal in high price range - a lot more capabilities in shader front and 2-3 times faster for most games...
http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040414/index.html


That's quite impressive! Let's see,  if ATI manages to get a smiliar powerful card out.

Xith3D Getting Started Guide (PDF,HTML,Source)
Offline ChrisM

JGO Coder


Medals: 3
Projects: 1
Exp: 14 years


Luke...END OF LINE


« Reply #6 - Posted 2004-04-17 16:11:33 »

ATI will bring out a competitor to the newest nVidia (got some scoop on it Wink).

Also, ATI had better MPEG2 hardware desompression, better texture quality, higher precision, and better "output".  Yes, driver stability was questionable as early as 2 years ago, but they have been really improved as of late.

-ChrisM

Offline Raghar

Junior Member




Ue ni taete 'ru hitomi ni kono mi wa dou utsuru


« Reply #7 - Posted 2004-04-17 16:22:35 »

I thought about 2.4 GHz Celleron, or a low end prescott. 256 MB RAM
120GB HD (Is better Seagate, or Maxtor?)
Motheboard with 3 slots for memory. (And enough PCI slots)
17'' LCD monitor.
128 MB 128 bit Nvidia FX would be enough.
DVD burner    I seen ths beast. http://www.alzasoft.cz/DetailPage.asp?DPG=44731

to duncanIdaho

How long is waranty for that memory? I just recently seen one broken one, it looked like common Windoze breakdowns (uncommon ones actually), or HD controller problems. Nasty, it took me aprox 1 Day until I tried to remove older memory block.

BTW I seen a really nice (and expensive) case with noise reduction. http://www.alzasoft.cz/DetailPage.asp?DPG=44209
This one is crazy too. http://www.alzasoft.cz/DetailPage.asp?DPG=43817
Actually I don't understand why do you want both DVD burner and CD-RW?


to NexusOne
Big HD is worth it, I'm unsure about the RAM isue.

Offline Jens

Senior Member




Java for games!


« Reply #8 - Posted 2004-04-18 15:34:35 »

Quote
ATI will bring out a competitor to the newest nVidia (got some scoop on it Wink).

Also, ATI had better MPEG2 hardware desompression, better texture quality, higher precision, and better "output".  Yes, driver stability was questionable as early as 2 years ago, but they have been really improved as of late.


It's nice to have some competition. I'm just a little concerned about the power the new cards, or new PCs in general, need. (NVidia recommends a 480W power supply.)

Xith3D Getting Started Guide (PDF,HTML,Source)
Offline Jens

Senior Member




Java for games!


« Reply #9 - Posted 2004-04-18 15:43:03 »

Quote
I thought about 2.4 GHz Celleron, or a low end prescott. 256 MB RAM
120GB HD (Is better Seagate, or Maxtor?)
Motheboard with 3 slots for memory. (And enough PCI slots)
17'' LCD monitor.
128 MB 128 bit Nvidia FX would be enough.
DVD burner    I seen ths beast. http://www.alzasoft.cz/DetailPage.asp?DPG=44731


128 MB NVidia FX doesn't mean a lot. It can be everything from an entry level to a highly expensive card. I recommend more RAM and an Athlon XP for games. Celerons usually have a good clock frequency, but this doesn't automatically mean good performance (they are a good choice for office PCs). Regarding the RAM I'd surely take 1 GB, if I'd buy a new PC, so I recommend at least 512 MB.

Xith3D Getting Started Guide (PDF,HTML,Source)
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline erikd

JGO Ninja


Medals: 16
Projects: 4
Exp: 14 years


Maximumisness


« Reply #10 - Posted 2004-04-18 16:54:20 »

Quote
(Is better Seagate, or Maxtor?)


Go for maxtor. I've had more than one bad experience with seagate. Maxtor never failed on me.

Offline Jens

Senior Member




Java for games!


« Reply #11 - Posted 2004-04-18 18:07:20 »

Quote
Go for maxtor. I've had more than one bad experience with seagate. Maxtor never failed on me.


It's all personal experience. I use Seagate and am very happy.  Tongue

Xith3D Getting Started Guide (PDF,HTML,Source)
Offline duncanIdaho

Junior Member




invert mouse


« Reply #12 - Posted 2004-04-19 13:59:04 »

Raghar

> I thought about 2.4 GHz Celleron, or a low end prescott.

The Prescotts have not been getting the kind of press I'd like to see.  Basically they aren't any faster than the cheaper Northwoods.  

> 256 MB RAM

You'll want at least 512 if you are running XP and want performance.  I want a gig so I can edit video or run doom3 in memory.

> How long is waranty for that memory?

That's a good question, and I don't know, but Cosair seems to be the quality reccomendation across the board.

> Actually I don't understand why do you want both DVD burner and CD-RW?

There's no good reason, just the convience of two trays for copying.
Offline ChrisM

JGO Coder


Medals: 3
Projects: 1
Exp: 14 years


Luke...END OF LINE


« Reply #13 - Posted 2004-04-19 14:33:03 »

With regard to processors:

I would not purchase an Intel product today.  AMD has proven to be more reliable, faster (compared to same level processors), cheaper and overclockable.  In fact, I have only used AMD processors for the past 3 years and all of the systems we have built for GDC (this year and 2001) were AMD.  Stay AWAY from Celeron unless you just want to surf the web Smiley

512MB at least!  256MB won't be enough to run XP and games properly.  Also, don't worry about FSB above 400MHz and make sure that you pair the memory up in dual channel systems.

If you are looking for a great systemboard, go with a KT400 chipset or nForce.  I used a KT400 but forund that the nForce has better performance and a better feature set (integrated sound with SPDIF ports are amazing!) but are a bit more expensive.

With regard to DVD/CR-WR burners.  If you case has the slots, get a DVD burner and a dedicated CDRW.  Besides easier backups, you will probably be burning more CDs than DVDs and DVD drives tend to wear out more easily Smiley

-ChrisM

Offline duncanIdaho

Junior Member




invert mouse


« Reply #14 - Posted 2004-04-19 16:05:51 »

Quote
 Also, don't worry about FSB above 400MHz

I'm curious to hear your reasoning on the FSB, as it sets the speed limit for memory and all future upgrades.  Which leads to another of the Athlon64's advantages: since it has a memory controller on dye, it can run the board at the frequency of the chip ( or at least the memory. )  I don't have my special issue of MaximumPC in front of me, but I was reading about it last month in their "355 PC questions answered" issue.
Offline ChrisM

JGO Coder


Medals: 3
Projects: 1
Exp: 14 years


Luke...END OF LINE


« Reply #15 - Posted 2004-04-19 19:34:51 »

Quote

I'm curious to hear your reasoning on the FSB, as it sets the speed limit for memory and all future upgrades.  Which leads to another of the Athlon64's advantages: since it has a memory controller on dye, it can run the board at the frequency of the chip ( or at least the memory. )  I don't have my special issue of MaximumPC in front of me, but I was reading about it last month in their "355 PC questions answered" issue.


Because chances are you won't be purchasing RAM above 400MHz give the price point you are looking at.  Also, DDR RAM at 400MHz is quite stable and ther just isnt enough of a performance gain over 400MHz at this point to justify the MUCH higher prices of speedier RAM.  HOWEVER!  The new PC mobo architecture ( I forget the name of it) will be coming out later this year ( and will most likely be very expensive) and I would wait to see what they have to offer if you are looking beyone 400MHz FSB.

-ChrisM

Offline Breakfast

Senior Member




for great justice!


« Reply #16 - Posted 2004-04-23 13:45:18 »

From what I can tell,  duncanIdaho is right. Everything I have read lately has said don't buy a new pc now because everything you can buy at the moment is going to die out when the new motherboard technologies, pci express and friends arrive a bit later in the year.

My current pc was built from a lot of parts which are not terribly upgradeable ( I discovered when I started thinking about upgrading it ) and it's really annoying when it happens.
Offline Mark Thornton

Senior Member





« Reply #17 - Posted 2004-04-23 14:27:13 »

Quote
My current pc was built from a lot of parts which are not terribly upgradeable ( I discovered when I started thinking about upgrading it ) and it's really annoying when it happens.


If you keep your PC for at least 3 years, then at the end of 3 years it will probably not be sensibly upgradeable anyway. A processor upgrade will likely require a new motherboard and some new type of memory, maybe a new power supply. The hard disk capacity you already have will trivial along side a bottom of the range new drive.
Offline Jens

Senior Member




Java for games!


« Reply #18 - Posted 2004-04-23 15:15:37 »

Quote
If you keep your PC for at least 3 years, then at the end of 3 years it will probably not be sensibly upgradeable anyway. A processor upgrade will likely require a new motherboard and some new type of memory, maybe a new power supply. The hard disk capacity you already have will trivial along side a bottom of the range new drive.


I usually have the same strategy. Buying a moderately good PC for a good price and getting a new one after about three years with only small or no upgrades in between.

Xith3D Getting Started Guide (PDF,HTML,Source)
Offline cfmdobbie

Senior Member


Medals: 1


Who, me?


« Reply #19 - Posted 2004-04-23 16:32:30 »

Agreement here as well.  While things like PCI-Express will eventually make AGP redundant, that won't happen for a while yet.  AGP cards will still be produced years from now - they're still not taking advantage of all the speed that the full AGP spec allows.

IDE is still going strong despite S-ATA being better and faster.  You can still buy PCI graphics cards, even up to a 128MB GeForce FX 5200.  Despite PCI coming out at the beginning of the nineties, you could still buy top-quality ISA graphics cards up until the turn of the century.

If you pay too much attention to the tech media, you'd never buy a new computer - there's always something better on the horizon.  Buy a computer for the here-and-now, and enjoy it - if anything can be salvaged half a decade from now, that's a bonus!  But it shouldn't influence your purchase in 2004.

Hellomynameis Charlie Dobbie.
Offline Raghar

Junior Member




Ue ni taete 'ru hitomi ni kono mi wa dou utsuru


« Reply #20 - Posted 2004-04-23 17:45:53 »

I'm too poor for 512 MB. In fact I could discover some necessary repairs in my home, so MB update would change just to monitor update.

I listened that Athlons sometimes worked wrongly with low quality memory. I would be interested in a heat output comparisson as well. (Still remember how my current Celeron runned few months without cooler.)
Quote

With regard to DVD/CR-WR burners.  If you case has the slots, get a DVD burner and a dedicated CDRW.  Besides easier backups, you will probably be burning more CDs than DVDs and DVD drives tend to wear out more easily

I have over 70 CD with anime around. I'm looking forward to create hardened DVDs. (I live in remote location, and some people are overprotective. Then again nice backups...)
Offline Breakfast

Senior Member




for great justice!


« Reply #21 - Posted 2004-05-04 12:05:04 »

Quote
If you keep your PC for at least 3 years, then at the end of 3 years it will probably not be sensibly upgradeable anyway. A processor upgrade will likely require a new motherboard and some new type of memory, maybe a new power supply. The hard disk capacity you already have will trivial along side a bottom of the range new drive.

My plan was to find the best stuff that was compatible with my current motherboard and upgrade to that when it was dirt cheap in the hope I could stretch another year or so out of the PC. It transpires that the company who built the PC used a very old motherboard and my processor was the fastest it could work with. Lame.

Offline achoi77

Junior Newbie




Java games rock!


« Reply #22 - Posted 2004-05-07 21:54:53 »

My approach is different. I don't have a lot of money to spend, so I've always been buying gear on a budget. My aim isn't to get the newest hottest stuff that came out of the market, I simply can't afford it. Instead, I mostly look for stuff that is 3-6 months old. That way, it's neither so old it's obsolete, but also cheap enough to afford.

My suggestions on parts:

1) if you are going budget cpu, get an AMD chip. Don't bother wasting your money on intel. The Celerons are absolutely the most worthless chips on the market. So not worth it. You can get a pretty nice chip for less then $100. Granted, it's not gonna win any medals, but it'll get the job done. I still work on my Athlon 1.4 Ghz, it's chugging out a-ok.

2) Don't skimp out on ram. Get the most ram you can afford.  at the minimum, 512. More is better.  Faster is always better too, but I don't notice. I got pc2100, and I've been meaning to upgrade, but I've been lazy cause I feel there is no real need as of now. :-)

3) If you are looking for HD space, check the dollar/gig amount. (Only talking about IDE) I do all my shopping at newegg, and the cheapest I saw around 6-8 months ago were the 160 gig HD's. Samsung, Hitachi, Maxtor, WD all were around the same price, so whatever is your preference.  A quick search on newegg shows The WD HD for about almost 50 cents per gig.

4) Save money by getting a smaller SATA drive. I mostly use the SATA HD for apps, and the IDE drive for my 'files.' You could use that money saved to get a raid card and a second IDE drive to get your geek on. :-)

5) I *used* to play a lot of games, but not any as of lately (still meaning to get me a copy of KOTOR), so (to me) a video card is a video card is a video card.  I usually get the card that cost me $150 today, or 6 months from now.
Tongue A video card that costs me $150 today could still run EQ fine. But then again, I also play EQ with my on-board mobo video...

So save your money. You will always be upgrading in the future anyway, it's not that big a deal to get the newest stuff.  Cheesy

As for myself, the next computer I'm getting is a G5.  Wink

Or a powerbook, I haven't decided yet.
Offline swpalmer

JGO Coder




Where's the Kaboom?


« Reply #23 - Posted 2004-05-08 01:57:09 »

Quote
As for myself, the next computer I'm getting is a G5.  Wink

Or a powerbook, I haven't decided yet.


If you don't have a laptop, the Powerbook is one sweet machine.  I have an older 1 GHz G4 Powerbook... the newer ones are even better with built-in Bluetooth, Firewire 800, USB 2, etc...  Mine is only Firewire 400, USB 1, no bluetooth...

My next desktop will be a G5 or whatever Mac machine is available at the time too.   Since getting the powerbook I have decided I will never spend a cent on Wintel crap  - you get what you pay for..  I haven't bought a computer, other than the Powerbook since I got my Amiga 3000 over 10 years ago.  I get a PC for home supplied by my employer... (so I can "work" from home when I need to).  Technically it is theirs, but I can occasionally trade up.

Offline jared888

Senior Newbie




Eat your own shorts. Leave mine alone.


« Reply #24 - Posted 2004-05-11 18:42:23 »

Howdy,

Here is my criteria for buying computers. I have purchased two new ones in the past two years. Before that, it had been over 4 years since any major PC purchases.

Here are the rules I now abide by:
1) DVD doesn't belong on computers...yet. Unless you are burning them, and you know you will be using dvds a lot on your pc, skip it. Eventually, games will sell predominantly on DVD, but that is still a ways off.

2) CDRW for your media drive.

3) Unless you are playing games, or creating computer animation, use the onboard video.

4) Unless you are an audiophile, use the onboard sound. The fact is, if you don't have a $500 speaker set, that 150 dollar sound card is 150 dollars of junk. I use headphones and onboard sound.....works just fine.

5) Get the best video card you can afford.

6) Get the fastest processor (usually this means AMD) you can afford.

7) Get as much memory as you can afford.

Cool Skip the floppy. Save 20 bucks.

9) One hard drive is enough. 100 gig is enough.

10) Optical mouse is nice.

11) Anything else, install it later. See how you like the system as it is.

That's it. I do have a dvd player in mine, but that was a mistake. I watch dvds on TV with a dedicated dvd player.



Ignore all of the above if you really want cutting edge. But if you want a computer that will play well most games for the next three years, the above will do.

The second PC i bought wasa "wife wants to surf" and I got her a $300 out of the box celeron. She plays super collapse and Risk II on it. I tried installing Call of Duty, and it crashed. Go figure.

But my pc is an amd 1.5, 512 ram, Nvidia 4200 128mb agp and I can cruise the highest detail settings on CoD without a hitch. I bought it 1.5 years ago, and it still runs the fastest settings on the latest games.

Installed netbeans tho, and it turned into a piece 'o junk.....

I need another 512mb memory obviously.


Beware the rabbit of the mind, for it gnaweth on the carrot of the soul.
Offline duncanIdaho

Junior Member




invert mouse


« Reply #25 - Posted 2004-05-13 22:40:50 »

http://arstechnica.com/news/posts/1084398037.html
Quote
Video Array is an accelerated graphics processing subsystem that will allow users to add multiple, off-the-shelf video cards to their Alienware computer systems and have both cards process graphic commands in parallel...
Alienware is currently saying that they expect users to see a ~50% performance boost over single card implementations

Awww yeah!  Note that the Video Array uses PCI Express cards. Roll Eyes


Offline Raghar

Junior Member




Ue ni taete 'ru hitomi ni kono mi wa dou utsuru


« Reply #26 - Posted 2004-06-15 20:25:21 »

Now I have arrived into choosing my processor.
I have these on mind.
2.4 GHz Prescott 1MB L2 cache 533 (4x133)
2500 Barton 333 (2x166)
2.5 GHz Prescott - 256 533 (4x133)

Board manufacturer would be Asus. Chipset would be preffered intel xxxPE, or NForce2.
Problem with Barton is no SSE2 instructions, also it seems that avilable boards doesn't have crash free 2 bios.
Problems with Intel processors could be obvious.

How well would Athlon board work with FX 5500?
Offline NexusOne

Junior Member




Java games rock!


« Reply #27 - Posted 2004-06-17 20:30:57 »

thanks for the advice guys
Pages: [1]
  ignore  |  Print  
 
 
You cannot reply to this message, because it is very, very old.

 

Add your game by posting it in the WIP section,
or publish it in Showcase.

The first screenshot will be displayed as a thumbnail.

Dwinin (26 views)
2014-09-12 09:08:26

Norakomi (57 views)
2014-09-10 13:57:51

TehJavaDev (71 views)
2014-09-10 06:39:09

Tekkerue (36 views)
2014-09-09 02:24:56

mitcheeb (57 views)
2014-09-08 06:06:29

BurntPizza (41 views)
2014-09-07 01:13:42

Longarmx (27 views)
2014-09-07 01:12:14

Longarmx (34 views)
2014-09-07 01:11:22

Longarmx (33 views)
2014-09-07 01:10:19

mitcheeb (40 views)
2014-09-04 23:08:59
List of Learning Resources
by Longor1996
2014-08-16 10:40:00

List of Learning Resources
by SilverTiger
2014-08-05 19:33:27

Resources for WIP games
by CogWheelz
2014-08-01 16:20:17

Resources for WIP games
by CogWheelz
2014-08-01 16:19:50

List of Learning Resources
by SilverTiger
2014-07-31 16:29:50

List of Learning Resources
by SilverTiger
2014-07-31 16:26:06

List of Learning Resources
by SilverTiger
2014-07-31 11:54:12

HotSpot Options
by dleskov
2014-07-08 01:59:08
java-gaming.org is not responsible for the content posted by its members, including references to external websites, and other references that may or may not have a relation with our primarily gaming and game production oriented community. inquiries and complaints can be sent via email to the info‑account of the company managing the website of java‑gaming.org
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Managed by Enhanced Four Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!