Java-Gaming.org    
Featured games (79)
games approved by the League of Dukes
Games in Showcase (477)
Games in Android Showcase (107)
games submitted by our members
Games in WIP (536)
games currently in development
News: Read the Java Gaming Resources, or peek at the official Java tutorials
 
    Home     Help   Search   Login   Register   
Pages: [1]
  ignore  |  Print  
  Competition - Ideas, thoughts, tactics  (Read 4031 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Offline blahblahblahh

JGO Coder


Medals: 1


http://t-machine.org


« Posted 2004-03-23 14:20:59 »

Well, we've got 2 months, a tiny number of huge prizes, and (I think) lots of people who want to enter (if they can).

In typical games-industry style, I'm assuming that people here are more interested in sharing thoughts. ideas, advice on this rather than keeping silent "in case we give a competitor any help".

So. Thoughts? Plans? Tactics?

To start with, I think the biggest thing here is "what can we do in the time available?". AFAICS from the rules, competition WILL be fierce (assuming they have a significant number of entrants), since people will be entering projects that they've already been working on for some months - those will be allowed, so they are the competition to aim for.

At the same time, it's ONLY TWO MONTHS (Cas, any comment on dev time for first gold release of AF?). At the moment there's also this big question mark over whether 3rd part libs / middleware / etc will be allowed unless it's 100% java. This makes that time frame look very small indeed.

AFAICS you either have to be a mobile games developer (there are lots and lots of professional independent mobile games studios) or else it's probably impossible for most people alone to get anything worthy completed. I'm guessing the best way forwards is to group into teams (I'm assuming that the majority of entrants will be individuals - partly because of the entry criteria, partly because there are so very very very few java games studios) so that you can make that 2 months go as far as possible...

malloc will be first against the wall when the revolution comes...
Offline blahblahblahh

JGO Coder


Medals: 1


http://t-machine.org


« Reply #1 - Posted 2004-03-23 14:31:38 »

Quote

AFAICS you either have to be a mobile games developer


On second thoughts, does anyone else even have a chance? There are tons of J2ME shops around (I'm assuming a large numer aren't ELSPA members either), and surely with only 4 prizes and only one category it's going to be very hard to compete with e.g. teams with 5 artists, 3 programmers and 2 designers (seems a pretty usual make up for a J2ME shop from what I've seen, but perhaps someone who actually works in mobile games dev could correct me here? Smiley)

...or did they design this contest only thinking bout the american market, and forget how many j2me shops there are in europe?

malloc will be first against the wall when the revolution comes...
Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 343
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #2 - Posted 2004-03-23 15:36:13 »

I could get a complete game out in 2 months if I worked damned hard on it full time and quit my job and left everyone under my command in a world of shit, but then I would not be doing it for a titchy chance of winning a prize I don't need. Just show me the money and I'm your bitch.

Cas Smiley

Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline blahblahblahh

JGO Coder


Medals: 1


http://t-machine.org


« Reply #3 - Posted 2004-03-23 15:54:34 »

Quote
I could get a complete game out in 2 months if I worked damned hard on it full time and quit my job and left everyone under my command in a world of shit,


That's pretty much what I thought, which is why I reckon people will *have* to make teams.

My experience of one-off games suggests that 2 months is about long enough to get started, and another 1 - 3 months is needed to get an original good game. In 3 months - with exceptional planning - 2-5 people teams seem regularly able to crank out small games.

From the discussions last time the idea of a compo came up (last year) I thought the "donated assets" had gained enough ground that it might actually happen (i.e. the organiser arranging for assets that every contestant could use to reduce dev time - e.g. by getting a 3d model library as a sponsor, or negotiating partial access to a commercial sprites library, commercial SFX libs (like the £20 CD's) etc)

Quote

Just show me the money and I'm your bitch.


(fx: blah chokes on coffee LOL)

malloc will be first against the wall when the revolution comes...
Offline blahblahblahh

JGO Coder


Medals: 1


http://t-machine.org


« Reply #4 - Posted 2004-03-23 15:58:53 »

NB: anyone entering, if you're doing a networked / multiplayer game, have a look at the grexengine (http://www.grexengine.com). We have a couple of developers making games on free or trial development-licenses at the moment, and if you're doing a game that would benefit from the GE we might be able to help.

But on the 2-mnth timeframe your requirements would need to fit closely with the modules we've got available right now, AND you'd need to be using parts of the GE that's particularly easy - there isn't time to learn a new arch from scratch!

malloc will be first against the wall when the revolution comes...
Offline nonnus29

Senior Member




Giving Java a second chance after ludumdare fiasco


« Reply #5 - Posted 2004-03-23 16:03:26 »

Would a j2me shop push the technical envelope though?  That requirement pretty much requires some ogl of some sort.

Imo, the winner will undoubtedly be some 3d extravaganza thats been in developement for 6+ months that we just haven't seen yet.

I would have liked to have seen a requirement that game must be new for this contest.  That would exclude people getting ready to goto alpha.  It would be hard to enforce/defend legally though.

Tactics; given the time scale I was thinking the best way to go would be to do a 'simple' platform style game of somesort.  Single player, one controller.  No pathfinding or overly complex event system.  

So then I was thinking a jumpnrun/streetfighter game in 3d from a side-on 2d angle like that one demo that was posted around here a few months ago with the martian md2 model (can't remember who posted it...).  

EDIT: http://www.java-gaming.org/cgi-bin/JGNetForums/YaBB.cgi?board=Announcements;action=display;num=1069505152

The key would be presentation; a ton of particle and lighting effects, plus professional level models.  But thats the problem isn't it?

Looking at other contests like iDevgames Mac contest, the top contestants are the ones who do innovative stuff with really basic building blocks and gameplay.  Do a simple game really well and you should stand a chance.
Offline Orangy Tang

JGO Kernel


Medals: 56
Projects: 11


Monkey for a head


« Reply #6 - Posted 2004-03-23 16:15:30 »

Quote

At the same time, it's ONLY TWO MONTHS

Thats a really tight time limit for getting a game to beta level from scratch. I'd say its pretty much impossible for a single person, you'd need at least two programmers to manage to make that deadline if its going to be properly polished with all that mundane stuff like a proper front end etc. *and* have good gameplay.

Prebuilt engine/toolbox tech would be the order of the day, and probably randomly generated content to cut down on time spent making assets etc.

[ TriangularPixels.com - Play Growth Spurt, Rescue Squad and Snowman Village ] [ Rebirth - game resource library ]
Offline blahblahblahh

JGO Coder


Medals: 1


http://t-machine.org


« Reply #7 - Posted 2004-03-23 16:26:21 »

I had a longer response, but decided to stay firmly on-topic Smiley.

Quote
Would a j2me shop push the technical envelope though?  That requirement pretty much requires some ogl of some sort.


Dunno about stateside, but in Europe from what I've seen there's lots of 3D mobile phone games already. I saw doom and tomb-raider on phones years ago (literally!).

Quote

Looking at other contests like iDevgames Mac contest, the top contestants are the ones who do innovative stuff with really basic building blocks and gameplay.  Do a simple game really well and you should stand a chance.


An obvious statement, but certainly worth saying. Thanks.

malloc will be first against the wall when the revolution comes...
Offline blahblahblahh

JGO Coder


Medals: 1


http://t-machine.org


« Reply #8 - Posted 2004-03-23 18:35:40 »

Quote

Imo, the winner will undoubtedly be some 3d extravaganza thats been in developement for 6+ months that we just haven't seen yet.


A friend just sent me the Gamedev net news item on this, which has this quote, which I hadn't spotted when reading the entry docs, but it's pretty explicit:
Quote

Calling all independent video game developers! Have you developed a cool video game using Java technology? If so, enter it in the 2004 Java Technology Game Development Contest and compete for $50,000 in prizes!


i.e. this is not a competition for people to write games, it's an attempt to get people who have already written games to let sun brag about it, and have a shot at getting a gamespy license (v. valuable if you need it). Which is fine, but not what was discussed at length on these boards, and hence I suspect not what most readers were expecting.

I guess this means we're back to square one?: no java game-dev contest (although of course plenty of other game dev contests which will accept java games).

malloc will be first against the wall when the revolution comes...
Offline Orangy Tang

JGO Kernel


Medals: 56
Projects: 11


Monkey for a head


« Reply #9 - Posted 2004-03-23 18:58:06 »

Quote

no java game-dev contest (although of course plenty of other game dev contests which will accept java games).

Not limited to java, but Lundam Dare have another 48-hour compo on soon:
http://www.ludumdare.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=291&forum=1

[ TriangularPixels.com - Play Growth Spurt, Rescue Squad and Snowman Village ] [ Rebirth - game resource library ]
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline swpalmer

JGO Coder




Where's the Kaboom?


« Reply #10 - Posted 2004-03-23 19:04:27 »

Quote

Thats a really tight time limit for getting a game to beta level from scratch. I'd say its pretty much impossible for a single person...

And yet if you were to come up with the original  "Tetris" you would have quite the hit... and be done in only a few days...

The right idea is key to getting some thing done within 2 months.  Though I agree, teams would be very helpful, with programming, and perhaps keeping motivated.

Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 343
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #11 - Posted 2004-03-23 21:23:47 »

Quote
his is not a competition for people to write games, it's an attempt to get people who have already written games to let sun brag about it
BTDTGTTS but I don't see $40k in the account. That bloody terrain demo was solid gold but no-one seems to have seen fit to sponsor the game that it was supposed to be Sad (Hint: look for Multiple Injury by Shaven Puppy on the wayback engine or something)

Cas Smiley

Offline gregorypierce

Senior Member




I come upon thee like the blue screen of death....


« Reply #12 - Posted 2004-03-23 22:51:15 »

Here is the big issue as I see it (kinda). Wurm and Alien Flux are up and running and pretty much complete. Chances of a new entry successfully competing against them? Slim. There are also a couple of other Java games such as Tribal Trouble which are a lot further than most out there. With those handful of games - the contest is mostly decided unless there are some groups of people who band together and hire some artists to work quickly to put something together Smiley

http://www.gregorypierce.com

She builds, she builds oh man
When she links, she links I go crazy
Cause she looks like good code but she's really a hack
I think I'll run upstairs and grab a snack!
Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 343
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #13 - Posted 2004-03-24 07:34:20 »

AF has been and gone and had its day and is now relegated to the depths of curiosity (and, to boot, it's not a particularly amazing demonstration of Java technology is it?) TT uses the naughty LWJGL library too so that might not do it any favours but it is so far the most technically impressive thing I've seen in Java. Ever.

Cas Smiley

Offline kevglass

JGO Kernel


Medals: 120
Projects: 23
Exp: 18 years


Coder, Trainee Pixel Artist, Game Reviewer


« Reply #14 - Posted 2004-04-01 08:54:49 »

In addition, didn't I read somewhere that Sun wants to take control of the winning entry..

No commerical venture is going to do this are they?

Kev

Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 343
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #15 - Posted 2004-04-01 09:42:42 »

If Sun want to buy AF off of me, they're more than welcome. I could do with the money to write another game.

Cas Smiley

Offline ChrisM

JGO Coder


Medals: 1
Projects: 1


END OF LINE.


« Reply #16 - Posted 2004-04-01 15:17:02 »

Quote
In addition, didn't I read somewhere that Sun wants to take control of the winning entry..

No commerical venture is going to do this are they?

Kev


Hrmmm....NO Kev Smiley

Sun just retains the right to use the game for promotion (advertising).  Since when did Sun become a content company?

-chrisM

Offline kevglass

JGO Kernel


Medals: 120
Projects: 23
Exp: 18 years


Coder, Trainee Pixel Artist, Game Reviewer


« Reply #17 - Posted 2004-04-01 15:18:42 »

Ah ha! Apologies for a mis-quote. Makes a bit more sense that way I suppose.

Kev

Pages: [1]
  ignore  |  Print  
 
 
You cannot reply to this message, because it is very, very old.

 

Add your game by posting it in the WIP section,
or publish it in Showcase.

The first screenshot will be displayed as a thumbnail.

Riven (13 views)
2014-07-29 18:09:19

Riven (10 views)
2014-07-29 18:08:52

Dwinin (10 views)
2014-07-29 10:59:34

E.R. Fleming (28 views)
2014-07-29 03:07:13

E.R. Fleming (10 views)
2014-07-29 03:06:25

pw (40 views)
2014-07-24 01:59:36

Riven (39 views)
2014-07-23 21:16:32

Riven (27 views)
2014-07-23 21:07:15

Riven (28 views)
2014-07-23 20:56:16

ctomni231 (59 views)
2014-07-18 06:55:21
HotSpot Options
by dleskov
2014-07-08 03:59:08

Java and Game Development Tutorials
by SwordsMiner
2014-06-14 00:58:24

Java and Game Development Tutorials
by SwordsMiner
2014-06-14 00:47:22

How do I start Java Game Development?
by ra4king
2014-05-17 11:13:37

HotSpot Options
by Roquen
2014-05-15 09:59:54

HotSpot Options
by Roquen
2014-05-06 15:03:10

Escape Analysis
by Roquen
2014-04-29 22:16:43

Experimental Toys
by Roquen
2014-04-28 13:24:22
java-gaming.org is not responsible for the content posted by its members, including references to external websites, and other references that may or may not have a relation with our primarily gaming and game production oriented community. inquiries and complaints can be sent via email to the info‑account of the company managing the website of java‑gaming.org
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines | Managed by Enhanced Four Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!