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  New feature: coding experience  (Read 3668 times)
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Offline StumpyStrust
« Reply #30 - Posted 2014-02-01 23:33:00 »

Sheesh almost do not want to put my experience. Basically have been coding as long as I have been on here. All these people here that are younger with more years in coding boggles my mind...well not really but I feel ashamed for not starting sooner.

I like this idea but it may deter me or others from answering or trying to answer some questions as we my no longer be taken seriously with the piddling amount of time we have been coding for. 

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #31 - Posted 2014-02-01 23:42:33 »

We're a relatively friendly bunch. I think this experiment will work out fine - even if we escort one or two beloved ones to the padded room, to reflect upon their snarky remarks.

Remember that sharing something 'personal' (eventhough this barely qualifies as such) most of the time results in a better relation. I think it'll all be fine, but maybe I'm naive. That's why you don't even need to opt out: you're not 'in' by default. Nobody is going to hold it against you if you prefer holding your cards to your chest Smiley

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Online Damocles
« Reply #32 - Posted 2014-02-02 01:19:14 »

Ok, strictly talking I will count my first jump&run game, i have made as startin point for coding experience (on a Sinclair ZX Spectrum)

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Offline wessles

JGO Ninja


Medals: 49
Projects: 4
Exp: 3 years


Coding with bad posture since 2011... Nonstop.


« Reply #33 - Posted 2014-02-02 05:32:11 »

What do you mean by 'padded room,' Riven? You keep saying this. Does it mean to suspend JGO from them?

You don't know nerdiness yet; you haven't even met me!
www.wessles.com
Offline HeroesGraveDev

JGO Kernel


Medals: 212
Projects: 11
Exp: 2 years


If it wasn't Awesome, it wasn't me.


« Reply #34 - Posted 2014-02-02 06:14:11 »

What do you mean by 'padded room,' Riven? You keep saying this. Does it mean to suspend JGO from them?

It's the renaming of JGO Dishonourable.

Offline SHC
« Reply #35 - Posted 2014-02-02 10:00:00 »

I'd prefer overall experience to be shown instead of Java experience. I had only 2 years of java experience of 5½ years of general programming.

Nice feature BTW.

Offline Drenius
« Reply #36 - Posted 2014-02-02 15:24:49 »

Quote
It's the renaming of JGO Dishonourable.
And what is/was this? What for?
Offline Simn
« Reply #37 - Posted 2014-02-02 16:17:44 »

I'd prefer overall experience to be shown instead of Java experience. I had only 2 years of java experience of 5½ years of general programming.

Nice feature BTW.

I also support this. Maybe both @Riven?

- Simn
Offline Jimmt
« League of Dukes »

JGO Kernel


Medals: 114
Projects: 4
Exp: 3 years



« Reply #38 - Posted 2014-02-02 20:26:05 »

Quote
It's the renaming of JGO Dishonourable.
And what is/was this? What for?
It's a rank that replaces your usual rank, to publicly shame you Smiley
But now it's called "In Padded Room".
Offline Drenius
« Reply #39 - Posted 2014-02-02 20:53:31 »

@Jimmt
Already saw it, but what are you using it for? When? Why?

After this: back to topic.
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Offline ctomni231

JGO Ninja


Medals: 71
Projects: 1
Exp: 7 years


Not a glitch. Just have a lil' pixelexia...


« Reply #40 - Posted 2014-02-02 21:57:06 »

All about "JGO Dishonorab"... I mean... "The Padded Room".

You can scroll up on it to get the history, but the basics of it is that people were using medals as punishment and overcrowding the chit-chat monster with posts. In other words, it acts like the "calm before the storm", giving a little bit of a warning before you end up getting banned for bad forum behavior.

[/off-topic]

TBH... I was looking at the Exp, and it looks quite boring being a number. Can we change it to something a little bit more visible and entertaining like stars or something. Like...

  • 1 star => less than 1 year
  • 2 stars => 1 - 3 years
  • 3 stars => 4 - 7 years
  • 4 stars => 8 - 15 years
  • 5 stars => 16+ years

If they want the number details, then they can just look into the profile. But I feel that it'll make it more interesting if we had a visual icon representation of the experience. It'll also help make experience look more vague, which is good. Hopefully it'll also inspire newbies to stick with the language.

Offline Jimmt
« League of Dukes »

JGO Kernel


Medals: 114
Projects: 4
Exp: 3 years



« Reply #41 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:05:15 »

We already have stars for Riven's black-magic formula so I think adding more stars is unneccesary.
Offline ctomni231

JGO Ninja


Medals: 71
Projects: 1
Exp: 7 years


Not a glitch. Just have a lil' pixelexia...


« Reply #42 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:07:13 »

Ah, yeah, that is correct. We have taken up every single image of good merit already  Pointing

Offline Pauler
« Reply #43 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:07:25 »

TBH... I was looking at the Exp, and it looks quite boring being a number. Can we change it to something a little bit more visible and entertaining like stars or something. Like...


If they want the number details, then they can just look into the profile. But I feel that it'll make it more interesting if we had a visual icon representation of the experience. It'll also help make experience look more vague, which is good. Hopefully it'll also inspire newbies to stick with the language.

Or represent experience with levels, like it happens at rpg games.
Offline Mike

JGO Wizard


Medals: 69
Projects: 2
Exp: 5 years


Java guru wanabee


« Reply #44 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:12:05 »

Or represent experience with levels, like it happens at rpg games.

Experience != Years of experience. I'm sure that there are a few on the forum with less years of experience than me but that spent a lot more time per day in java. I think it is fine as it is.

Regarding displaying both, maybe keep the little space that is left for the next awesome feature Wink

If you feel that you are more experienced than the number of years make us believe, choose a higher number Smiley

Mike

My current game, Minecraft meets Farmville and goes online Smiley
State of Fortune | Discussion thread @ JGO
Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #45 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:12:37 »

There is this psychological issue about lying Smiley

The more 'vague' the representation, the more inclined you are to play the system. If we were to have this star-based system, people would be likely to change the number just enough to get that one extra star. If you, however blatantly ask for their experience, it's a lot harder to lie about it - like when somebody asks you to look into their eyes, and tell them what you just said was really the truth. Somehow it's much harder to lie when you can't beat about the bush.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Drenius
« Reply #46 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:24:26 »

@ Riven: It looks like you are thinking about it, what is good, but maybe a little (or not that little) bit too much...
People who have nothing better to do will lie about this.
But there is no real advantage by doing it. It  does not matter whether someone says the truth or not because it does not really affect anything important...
Offline Gef
« Reply #47 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:30:33 »

The Java experience information is interesting but only the result is important :
- When you ask a question, how who cares the experience of the answerer, if the answer is fine and usefull
- When you talk to somebody, more in a post, you always have to do it with respect, even with beginners.
That's all for me !  Wink

EDIT : correction of quick writing

Offline Agro
« Reply #48 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:31:57 »

you can probably tell if a person's given experience is consistent with what they say

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #49 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:36:11 »

@ Riven: It looks like you are thinking about it, what is good, but maybe a little (or not that little) bit too much...
IMHO the only proper way to 'shape' a community, is to actually think more about the little things than average Joe would do. Pointing Yes, that sounded arrogant, but what ya gonna do Kiss

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Drenius
« Reply #50 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:40:47 »

There was a post in a thread some time ago where somebody put together different steps for java programmers most people go through some time ago (where was it?)...
Maybe such a way would be a little bit better to measure java/programming experience, because we should not forget about years you leave out, are burnt out or such...
Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #51 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:48:59 »

What do you expect? People ranking themselves on the 'hello world', 'thy holy design' to 'treat code as a tool, not like an art' scale? Given the discussion sparked by the latest feature,  I can only imagine endless debate about the order of stages, and whether they belong on the scale in the first place.

As for allowing people to incorporate 'lost years', well, that's actually why I didn't implement this feature as 'when did you start'.

Sure, there are a dozen ways to do a better job, but I have this pesky thing called bills and a job to take care of them, mixed with time consuming mandatory social interaction with arbitrary loved ones. Well, that, and my impromptu motto: 'less is more, mkay' Tongue

Now get off my lawn, I'm mowing for the greater good!

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline ctomni231

JGO Ninja


Medals: 71
Projects: 1
Exp: 7 years


Not a glitch. Just have a lil' pixelexia...


« Reply #52 - Posted 2014-02-02 22:57:24 »

Well, honestly, even though I'm a fan of the feature, I am happy that people are still thinking about it.

The reason I thought about making more "vague" is exactly that, you told people that they should "lie" if they feel the representation wasn't fitting of the experience they had. It is amazing how changing something from a number to a medal carries a lot more weight.

All-in-all, this feature doesn't really do anything.

I mean, it doesn't account for talent, the ability for developers to complete projects in a timely manner, or even the ability to figure out a business application writer from an indie game programmer. All we have here is just a metric on how experienced someone is.

There is something very much in the "uncanny valley" when it comes to this feature. Even though I think it is a good idea, there is an eerie feeling I have of this feature being misused. I just haven't thought about how that could be yet...  persecutioncomplex

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #53 - Posted 2014-02-02 23:00:22 »

This feature was put in place to be naturally more considerate towards people that are (relatively) new to programming. As per the opening post.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline ags1

JGO Knight


Medals: 28
Projects: 2
Exp: 5 years


Make code not war!


« Reply #54 - Posted 2014-02-02 23:04:43 »

I put 5 years, but I'm a technical writer so it doesn't count :-)

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #55 - Posted 2014-02-02 23:04:51 »

I mean, it doesn't account for talent, the ability for developers to complete projects in a timely manner, or even the ability to figure out a business application writer from an indie game programmer. All we have here is just a metric on how experienced someone is.
Well, obviously. We even fail to measure all of this in a job interview, and sometimes in a job. I do not aspire to make this statistic an accurate representation of skill... it's experience, measured in time, because that's quantifiable in a way that everybody can grasp. It's just another number to be integrated in all the impressions we get from peoples questions, answers and projects.

And then there is the issue of self evaluation. Ask somebody whether he/she is smart - the vast majority deems themselves smarter than average. Does that make sense? Absolutely not. The underlying problem is that we can't imagine how it is to be smarter than we are ourselves. The same applies to experience. Throughout your life you'll be likely to consider yourself experienced in what you do. Looking back on the last years, you'll recognize that you were actually inexperienced. A few years from now you'll say the same about today. We can deduce from that that experience actually is time related - it's just that everybody just has it's own base level and coefficient. My conclusion is that it's valuable to crudely express experience in time, especially for the first years of attaining said experience.

@Gef: This metric ought to be used to evaluate questions, not answers. As per the opening post.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Gef
« Reply #56 - Posted 2014-02-02 23:57:11 »

That could be used in the two ways.
I said that for people who could think a 6 months experience person can't have a good idea or explanation to offer.
I also said that I'm aiming nobody on JGO  Tongue

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #57 - Posted 2014-02-02 23:57:44 »

Nobody has the answer - we'll see how it pans out.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline kingroka123

JGO Knight


Medals: 22
Projects: 3
Exp: 10-12 months


Gamer's Helmet


« Reply #58 - Posted 2014-02-03 01:41:49 »

Now that I see everyone else's experience, I feel very humbled. Still, I like this feature very much

Offline HeroesGraveDev

JGO Kernel


Medals: 212
Projects: 11
Exp: 2 years


If it wasn't Awesome, it wasn't me.


« Reply #59 - Posted 2014-02-03 07:32:49 »

I think it's an interesting feature, and I like it.

However, as far as Riven's use case goes, I'm not sure it will really work that way.

People relatively new to programming (and so also this forum) are not going to know about the feature, and so we won't be able to tell anyway. And then when they do find it, how many of them are going to want to admit they've only been programming for so short?

And if you're worrying about not having been a programmer very long, look at it the other way around. Think of it as "I've only been programming for _ and I am able to do _ etc."

In the end, it's about your skill, your participation in the community, and your friendliness that people are going to watch for, not how long you've been programming.

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