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  Surivial Gameplay  (Read 1983 times)
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Offline Pilldom

Senior Newbie


Projects: 1



« Posted 2013-05-30 07:38:47 »

I hope this is the right section.

I have been working on my game for quite a few months now. When I first started I envisioned it as a game where you basically are set up in the woods, and you have to survive. A number of different factors would weight on you from hunger to sanity to health(in disease sense not a hp sense). However, not that I am completing more and more of the game, I am finding that it seems like there is very little to do. While there are still more things for me to add, it seems strange to me now if the only objective is to survive.

Would you play a game where you simply go out and survive in the wild, or would you want some kind of story line or ulterior motives to go with it.

Any thoughts on this would be great.
Thanks
Offline HeroesGraveDev

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« Reply #1 - Posted 2013-05-30 07:59:13 »

Do one well.

Don't try to do both and end up with two mediocre implementations of ideas.

Offline Pilldom

Senior Newbie


Projects: 1



« Reply #2 - Posted 2013-05-30 08:48:00 »

Do you believe then that if done well a survival game could be enjoyable, based on the objective just being to survive?
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Offline hellrazer21

Junior Member





« Reply #3 - Posted 2013-05-30 11:45:36 »

if you make it so theres a constant struggle that keeps the player fighting to survive then it becomes fun but if theres too much time where you just stand around and do whatever you want you'll lose the players attention

think of the gameplay like a graph

|                     ________
|     ___          /             \                              
|   /      \       /                \                            |
|  /        \___/                  \                           |F
| /                                   \                          |U
|/                                     \_______________ |N
-----------------------------------------------
                      TIME

if the player isn't active he's not having fun and you get a flat part on the graph

the trick is to get the player excited with a good hook like when you watch a good action movie its starts off with some crazy action scene you have no idea whats going on but your watching the movie cause its got your attention with that hook then theres always those ups and downs in the graph in this case the movie would have the boring scenes where characters talk(this is the down part) then all of a sudden bam theres people shooting and blood everywhere and those are the up parts of the graph

every good movie, game, book follows that graph they get you with that hook then theres a few small ups and downs and we all heard of the grand finale well that part is just a big spike at the end of the graph thats the part that seals the deal and makes people remember the game,movie or book

|                __                  /\___  |
|    _         /    \      __      /         |          
|   / \       /      \    /    \   /          |
|  /   \___/        \_/       \/            |F
| /                                            |U
|/                                             |N
 ---------------------------------
                      TIME

a survival game could work but you need to find the right balance keeping the player entertained and having fun

alot of games have bosses at the end of each level to keep the player looking forward to something or they have a cutscene for the player to watch between levels

if your going with a free roam game then you need a story for the player to look forward to

any game can be turned into a good game its just a matter of good game design

Offline heisenbergman

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« Reply #4 - Posted 2013-05-30 11:47:44 »

Well, DayZ's point is just to survive afaik and it's been hugely successful.

Offline 65K
« Reply #5 - Posted 2013-05-30 12:00:57 »

Well, DayZ's point is just to survive afaik and it's been hugely successful.
Because there is so little to do in DayZ it evolved to just another ego shooter. Everybody shoots at first sight.

Offline hellrazer21

Junior Member





« Reply #6 - Posted 2013-05-30 12:05:47 »

dayz is a mod for a game that already had tons of players of course its going to be successful

we're talking single player game here
one with no following ... thats when the graph works



Offline heisenbergman

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« Reply #7 - Posted 2013-05-30 12:14:48 »

Well, DayZ's point is just to survive afaik and it's been hugely successful.
Because there is so little to do in DayZ it evolved to just another ego shooter. Everybody shoots at first sight.
Ah well yeah the multiplayer aspect of it has probably contributed the most to its appeal.

dayz is a mod for a game that already had tons of players of course its going to be successful
I don't think it follows.

Online Jimmt
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« Reply #8 - Posted 2013-05-30 18:42:40 »

Dayz's appeal was being in an open world multiplayer environment, as opposed to previous zombie games like l4d2 that were level based, and primarily focused on killing. In my opinion survival games need to have a lot of random effects - a flood, sudden outbreak of zombies, etc. Otherwise, survival just becomes a boring grind.
Offline kalkitus

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« Reply #9 - Posted 2013-05-30 20:15:28 »

Playing survival games with friends or strangers is what makes them fun, for me at least. Maybe try toying with multi-player support?
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Offline Pilldom

Senior Newbie


Projects: 1



« Reply #10 - Posted 2013-05-30 20:42:58 »

I had considered multiplayer but it would take me a considerably large amount of time to not only get the networking done but convert all my existing code to multiplayer.

While I agree with the boss fights, one thing I didn't want was a kind of end game. Where a player accomplishes something and its done.

One thing I had considered, was at some point implementing a kind of "class system". The class system would be based on what your previous occupation and personality was. That in turn would then effect what the bigger accomplishment would be.
For example, one classes goal would be to survive and thrive and start a small farm. Anothers would be to explore the whole island and learn all of its history. Just tinier things to keep the player occupied while they survive.

Unfortunately one thing I didn't want in my game was combat. So aside from wolves that come out at night, there is little i the way of opponents, and little you can do against them.
Offline hellrazer21

Junior Member





« Reply #11 - Posted 2013-05-31 00:56:13 »

you sound like your trying to build an rpg

by the way every game has an end even mmorpg games
you finish the mission/quest or whatever the rest would be trying to get a highscore or just the social part of the game is what would keep the games alive

Online Jimmt
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« Reply #12 - Posted 2013-05-31 01:08:44 »

by the way every game has an end even mmorpg games
Definitely not true, most games with procedurally generated content can go on infinitely, like Minecraft. Most of the time you think of procedurally generated dungeons and levels, but it is possible to generate quests/dialogue as well.
Offline BrassApparatus

Junior Member





« Reply #13 - Posted 2013-05-31 01:09:32 »

I disagree, think of minecraft, for a very long time there was no endgame. For me it was enough to survive, explore and learn. I'm also highly supportive of the idea that games can be noncombative.
I recommend watching this, it will probably only raise more thoughts and questions but I think there's a lot to learn.
Offline HeroesGraveDev

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« Reply #14 - Posted 2013-05-31 04:45:33 »

Minecraft too has an end.
You get to the point where you just do the same thing again and again with a different situation and end up with a similar result.
I reached that point shortly after I started (and finished) modding. (then again, modding Minecraft is how I started programming, so maybe I was just too busy with that)

The best thing in a survival game is multiplayer. Interacting with friends to create an existence is so much more satisfying (and sometimes entertaining) than doing it alone.

Offline wessles

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Radirius Software Developer


« Reply #15 - Posted 2013-06-09 04:06:44 »

I like how you guys only got to minecraft at the end...

I like minecraft, however, it gets old once you get up from bed, put on your full diamond enchanted, take the metro system you made, and going mining, just gets old. The only 3 reason minecraft is not boring anymore is these:
-Modding support
-Constant updates
-Custom maps (although this is aside from the point)

Just try to shake things up constantly. And yes, if some game makes a questline or something while being like minecraft where you make and build everything, then yes. That will be the new thing (In my opinion, which is that of a 13 year old programmer/heavy gamer).

Offline Oskuro

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Coding in Style


« Reply #16 - Posted 2013-06-09 20:57:49 »

 People, games do not need to be infinitely replayable.

Pilldom, just focus on making your idea and implementation interesting. If you don't get it with this game, you'll get it with the next, no one says you can't make "nameless survival game 2: the survivening" afterwards  Wink


As for having an objective, if you really need one, just give the player a way to escape its situation, meaning, they have to survive for a reason (they are lost, stranded, directionally challenged) and there can be a way for them to get out of it.

Easy example: Have the player crash its plane into a deserted island at the start of the game, and have the pieces needed for the radio (to call for help) spread out throughout the terrain, so the player needs to survive while looking for the pieces.


Offline NegativeZero

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« Reply #17 - Posted 2013-06-10 12:06:13 »

Just a tip if you do decide to go down the "infinite game" path: throughout the game, your character will become stronger and stronger, I would presume, as a way of not having the same game for as long as possible. In this scenario, your monsters would also appropriately scale, too. If you do take this path, make sure that your player can not only progress, but go backwards. Maybe his gun runs out of ammo so he can't kill anymore.
Offline hellrazer21

Junior Member





« Reply #18 - Posted 2013-06-11 09:15:50 »

@NegativeZero
i think that sounds like an RPG game with level and stuff

Offline HeroesGraveDev

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« Reply #19 - Posted 2013-06-11 09:26:09 »

In a survival game, upgrading the character is a matter of getting better equipment, not levelling up and stats, as it detaches the player from the character making death less likely to cause ragequits, and more of a "I should do X different next time, and maybe I'll get better stuff too."

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