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  Java Game Edition  (Read 7486 times)
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Offline Mads

JGO Ninja


Medals: 24
Projects: 3


One for all!


« Reply #60 - Posted 2012-07-21 17:12:59 »

I have been developing in Java for a long time and it puzzles me the state of things in it. Why is Java so bad for so many things? When it is glaringly obvious by the competition that there are better ways of doing things.

Java moves at a glacial pace.

Only in Java 8 we are getting closures and defender methods. And the impression I get is that it happened only because Java development was humiliated so badly that Sun/Oracle had no other choice. Does it really need to reach such a point?

Java is a pathetic non-competitor in gaming because of this "insular" attitude.

Where are you going with this? If you don't like it, you're free to leave. You're currently in a community of game developers, that generally like to write their games in java. Proposing such a point, on this forum, is obviously asking for attention. It's also cheeky.

Can we lock this thread already?

Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 282
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #61 - Posted 2012-07-21 17:27:29 »

I have been developing in Java for a long time and it puzzles me the state of things in it. Why is Java so bad for so many things? When it is glaringly obvious by the competition that there are better ways of doing things.

Java moves at a glacial pace.

Only in Java 8 we are getting closures and defender methods. And the impression I get is that it happened only because Java development was humiliated so badly that Sun/Oracle had no other choice. Does it really need to reach such a point?

Java is a pathetic non-competitor in gaming because of this "insular" attitude.
@longino, it mysteriously hasn't stopped Puppygames, Three Rings, Mojang, Oddlabs, Swing Swing Submarine and others from making a small fortune though.
Tip: language has nothing to do with making games in the grand scheme of things. You are merely looking for excuses for your own failures.

Cas Smiley

Offline longino

Junior Member


Medals: 1



« Reply #62 - Posted 2012-07-21 17:47:21 »

There's an endemic lack of professionalism in here. It must be because the majority of Java game developers are hobbyists and not professionals, and that explains their inability to grasp the basics. An amateur has all the time of the world in his hands.

When you are professionally involved with something, you have a deadline. And your job depends on it. That's how you pay your bills. Then every hour you spend fiddling around with libraries, trying to make them work or just evaluating them, is an hour less you have to develop your product.

That's why there are Integrated Development Environments. Their purpose is to provide all to tools and libraries you would need to develop and deploy a product in one place. This way it is possible to focus on the actual product development.

I have the impression I am going over people's heads in here. This should be common sense for anyone taking game development seriously.  This attitude explains a lot in fact.

Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline sproingie
« Reply #63 - Posted 2012-07-21 17:47:53 »

Obvious troll is obvious.  Why even unban him?  If he stays here, he will do nothing but make the atmosphere as toxic as possible.
Offline longino

Junior Member


Medals: 1



« Reply #64 - Posted 2012-07-21 17:49:43 »

Obvious troll is obvious.  Why even unban him?  If he stays here, he will do nothing but make the atmosphere as toxic as possible.


Grow up.
Offline Mads

JGO Ninja


Medals: 24
Projects: 3


One for all!


« Reply #65 - Posted 2012-07-21 17:55:02 »

Ahem. The libraries and extendability is what makes Java a very productive language to use. You have to do minimal work, if it doesn't fall directly under your game logic. We've a lot of functionality covered.

A lack of professionalism, you say. Yet, you're the person replying with "Grow up.". Excellent work, on the double morals front.

Offline sproingie
« Reply #66 - Posted 2012-07-21 18:00:05 »

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/5IaNaQHjIRE?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;start=50" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/5IaNaQHjIRE?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;start=50</a>

(mad props to Riven for adding time offsets to embedded videos!)
Offline kappa
« League of Dukes »

JGO Kernel


Medals: 70
Projects: 15


★★★★★


« Reply #67 - Posted 2012-07-21 18:17:58 »

Agreed that language has little to do with whether a product is successful or not.

Saw the following article a few days ago and seems pretty true:

Java won the smartphone wars (and nobody noticed)
Offline jonjava
« Reply #68 - Posted 2012-07-21 18:20:50 »

Then every hour you spend fiddling around with libraries, trying to make them work or just evaluating them, is an hour less you have to develop your product.

Actually, I've found that's what 80% of development is about. Finding the things you need and learning how to use it to get something to work. Fiddling through coworkers code, interfaces and reading API's etc

Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 282
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #69 - Posted 2012-07-22 02:07:32 »

One advantage you might have with Java is just how few libraries there are to evaluate. Helps focus you on just getting the job done.

Cas Smiley

Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline sproingie
« Reply #70 - Posted 2012-07-22 03:13:16 »

In the areas where it's been a success, Java has an embarassment of riches when it comes to getting just about anything done.  Web frameworks, let's see, JavaEE alone gives you JSP or facelets for view layers, then for backend you have servlets+ejb or JAX-WS or JAX-RS.  Not to mention Stripes, Struts, Seam, Wicket, Tapestry, Spring MVC, and on and on...   XML parsers, how's two or three dozen strike you?  Build systems, you've got ant, maven, gradle, buildr.  To say nothing of the number of different languages that target the JVM...


Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 605
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #71 - Posted 2012-07-22 03:15:12 »

Obvious troll is obvious.  Why even unban him?
I did not unban him, I will investigate.

BTW, I wanted to post [you tube]5IaNaQHjIRE#t=50s[/you tube]
Fixed!

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Damocles
« Reply #72 - Posted 2012-07-22 03:44:12 »

This discussion is like a Tupperware Salesman talking to a Potterer creating handmade pottery.

"Look how easy they stack and can exchange covers in 5 different colors"
vs
"Look how nice of a pattern I can draw when I use a knitting pen and press here softly"

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