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  Daedalus - no escape  (Read 99672 times)
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Offline 65K
« Reply #60 - Posted 2012-07-29 07:22:15 »

Nice progress.  Smiley
Makes me feel like starting Eclipse and stop my current programming pause due to lack of motivation.
Nice particle effects, only blood in games does not attract me.
How do you do the AI ?

Offline matheus23

JGO Kernel

Medals: 122
Projects: 3

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« Reply #61 - Posted 2012-07-29 07:23:24 »

Makes me feel like starting Eclipse and stop my current programming pause due to lack of motivation.
Intresting... Are the times of programming pauses international the same? Cheesy

See my:
    My development Blog:     | Or look at my RPG | Or simply my coding
http://matheusdev.tumblr.comRuins of Revenge  |      On Github
Offline deathpat
« Reply #62 - Posted 2012-07-29 12:28:17 »

Thanks for your comments Smiley

concerning the AI, I've read a book Smiley This one :

I choosed this one because the main exemple developped in this book is very similar to my game. I really recommend this book, I had absolutly zero knowledge in AI before starting to read it ( was 3 weeks ago ) and today I have something that works for my game Smiley (even if there is still a lot to do ...)

Concerning the details of the AI, it is composed of several components :
- a steering component that is handling the movement of the bot, it basically contains basic behaviors to do things like move to a point, avoid walls, flee from a point .... they all just affect the speed vector of the bot
- a pathfinder to be able to find a path to go from point A to B on the map
- a memory component that is responsible of keeping track of the other bots that were in the field of view or that were heard recently.
- a targeting component responsible of selecting the appropriate enemy target, it uses the memory to know about potential targets
- a weapon system component responsible of selecting the appropriate weapon depending on the current target and to aim and shoot at this target
- and the brain component, which is using all the other ones. It works with nested goals, it decides of a main goal depending on the context and then tries to solve it. Each goal is composed of several subgoals. Right now I have only 2 main goals for my bots: explore the map and attack target.

For example the explore goal choose a random point on the map and use the pathfinder to get a path to it. Then it adds a "follow path" goal to itself.

The follow path goal will take each point of the path in order and will add a "traverse edge" goal each time it needs to go to the next point.

The traverse edge goal will activate the seek steering behavior to reach the target point and terminates when this point is reached.
When there is no point left in the path, the follow path goal terminates, and so the explore goal terminates ... and the brain will decide for a new goal to be added.

Note that at any time, the main goal can be changed depending on the context. For example if the bot is exploring the map and encounters another player in the middle of his explore path goal, this one will be discarded and replaced with "attack target" ( again depending on the context ... later the bot will not try to attack if it has a low health level, or no ammo left for example Smiley ).

Everything is very well explained in the book Smiley

The next demo I will post will have the debug features activated so you'll be able to see everything concerning the bots. Here is a screenshot showing it :

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline 65K
« Reply #63 - Posted 2012-07-29 12:39:52 »

Ok, both of our bots would get along quite well Wink
My AI was inspired by that book as well. Goals, a brain for memory, pathfinding. I have goals such as Hunt, Track, Shoot, Guard, Dodge, Chill, Power, Stray.
Only for the lower level physic stuff there is an additional state machine.
Yes, it's a very good book.

Offline Phased
« Reply #64 - Posted 2012-07-29 12:41:09 »

Thanks for linking that book, I think I might actually buy that soon, I have been looking to learn AI for a while Cheesy
Offline Phased
« Reply #65 - Posted 2012-07-29 13:04:43 »

just a question about that book, I saw it had C++ examples, so im guessing its all in C++, I have hardly touched C++, I just kinda know the really basics that I have picked up from my friend who thought it would be a good idea to go from straight to C++, he wouldn't listen to me, he spent about 4 - 6 months trying to make a calculator work XD (a command prompt calculator, so no GUI).

Is it hard to translate the code from C++ to Java?
Offline deathpat
« Reply #66 - Posted 2012-07-29 13:21:07 »

@65K : great, your bots seems to be well advanced Wink I had to change things as well for the lower physics as I'm using jbox2d ... but that was not a big deal in the end. I've also put all path finding stuffs in a separate thread .. I think it's better than having it in the main thread like in the book ( even if in the book the author proposes time sliced path finding Smiley )

@Phased : I used to do C++ in the past ( quite a long time ago, in a galaxy far far ... ), but I don't think it helped me Smiley The important things in the book are design and algorithms. So basically the C++ specifics are not important, you just have to understand the algorithm behind the code, and there are lots of comments so it's really not an issue ( at least it was not for me ).

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Offline Ultroman

JGO Knight

Medals: 25
Projects: 1

Snappin' at snizzes since '83

« Reply #67 - Posted 2012-07-29 15:46:34 »

This is beautiful! I can't wait until I'm ready to do that sort of thing. I'm still fighting with my second Java2D game. Looks like LWJGL is the way to go for the next game.

- Jonas
Offline tarlek

Junior Devvie

Medals: 2
Projects: 1

« Reply #68 - Posted 2012-08-31 22:38:38 »

Looks nice man.

My only complaint is that I actually use the mouse1/mouse2 for forward/backward, so it would be nice to be able to set the fire button to ctrl or whatever.

Offline deathpat
« Reply #69 - Posted 2012-09-01 01:02:23 »

Thanks for your comments, about the controls it's already done in the actual version, the one posted here is a bit outdated Smiley

I'm back from vacation and I finished to refactor the big buggy mess which was handling the game state ( I'm now using state machines and it's way cleaner Smiley ). So I will post a new demo this week end ... tomorrow I think Smiley

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline deathpat
« Reply #70 - Posted 2012-09-01 18:40:34 »

ok guys so here is a demo of the latest version :

The jar should run on windows / linux / mac.

This version includes :
- bots ( players controlled by the computer ). The number of bots + their level can be chosen at server creation time
- particle systems (blood, explosions, smoke, sparkles ...)
- new weapon : rocket launcher
- different player skins/color ( assigned randomly by now ... should do a menu to select it ). Only two skins are available in 4 colors each right now ( yes the two skins are very similar Smiley )
- some work to compensate internet lag
- other things I don't remember .. Smiley

To do next :
- optimize network messages size ... I'm sending too much ( and often non relevant) data right now Smiley
- ammo handling + weapon pickup
- bots aware of their health level to take decisions ( flee from battle, search for medikits ... )
- bots aware of their available ammo/weapons to select the appropriate one ( or eventually to search for a better weapon )
- menu to select the player skin
- menu to select the list of map running on the server
- in game menu for the server to be able to add/remove bots on the fly

I'm running 2 internet games on a server I have at home. If you try the game, please try to connect to them and tell me if the conditions for playing are all right ( as well as your ping by pressing F5 ).

Here are the details of the 2 servers :
- Main server A - 1M : running one small map with 1 bot level medium ... max players : 5
- Main server B - 4H : running two medium size maps with 4 bots level high ... max players : 12

Otherwise you can always run a local server with bots Smiley
For info the map selector is in the lobby, just above the start button ... it's temporary, I have to do a dedicated screen to be able to select several maps, and display some more info on them (recommended number of players, map name ... ideally a top view of the map) ...

I'm waiting for your comments !! Hope to see you in game Wink

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Offline ReBirth
« Reply #71 - Posted 2012-09-02 06:26:03 »

Yay boot! Now I can play it.

Offline deathpat
« Reply #72 - Posted 2012-09-03 22:11:29 »

Yay boot! Now I can play it.

Have you tried it ? If so, some feedback would be greatly appreciated Wink

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Offline Giovanni

Junior Devvie


« Reply #73 - Posted 2012-09-03 23:11:30 »

Oh I love this game. It's really polished, you got some nice sound effects and it runs really smooth on my computer.
The only thing I did not like about your game was the AI. I think it was quite hard for 'easy' [size=6pt](yes I'm a noob :x)[/size]. Bots did sometimes not turn around when you shot them and that was quite weird. Also, I would like to see a cross hair (or whatever). Makes me feel better to know where I am aiming to  Tongue
Offline deathpat
« Reply #74 - Posted 2012-09-03 23:31:07 »

Oh I love this game. It's really polished, you got some nice sound effects and it runs really smooth on my computer.
The only thing I did not like about your game was the AI. I think it was quite hard for 'easy' [size=6pt](yes I'm a noob :x)[/size]. Bots did sometimes not turn around when you shot them and that was quite weird. Also, I would like to see a cross hair (or whatever). Makes me feel better to know where I am aiming to  Tongue

Thanks for your feedback !
concerning the AI :
- yes that's something I was expecting to hear Cheesy It's quite hard to calibrate the levels of the bots because I play very often, and so it seems that I got skilled Cheesy I'll definitely have a look at this and try to make easy and medium levels more accessible. I usually play in hard or insane Smiley

- to tell the truth, bots never turn around when they are shot ( if they do it is just luck Smiley ). That's in the TODO list for the bots. Later they will react to shoots but also to the sounds produced by the other players ( shooting or even walking for instance ... )

- for the crosshair, I was not inclined to add one because I thought it would be to easy to hit with some weapons then ( machine gun and railgun ... ) ... but you're not the first one to say this so I think I'll reconsider it Smiley Maybe a small indicator at the top of the screen showing the impact point could be a solution ... I'll think about that Wink

Thanks again for your feedback ! I used to test the game with some friends who got pretty skilled as well ( they're all better than me ! Smiley ) so it's really interesting for me to get some feedback from people new to the game !

Just one question : did you connect an internet server or did you start a local game ?

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Offline Giovanni

Junior Devvie


« Reply #75 - Posted 2012-09-04 01:48:56 »

Just one question : did you connect an internet server or did you start a local game ?

A local game.
Offline Damocles
« Reply #76 - Posted 2012-09-04 05:02:23 »

really nice game.

CTF and Domination gamemodes would work nice too.

Offline ReBirth
« Reply #77 - Posted 2012-09-04 05:36:51 »

Yay boot! Now I can play it.

Have you tried it ? If so, some feedback would be greatly appreciated Wink

I've DLed it but not yet play Clueless hmm maybe at night.

Offline deathpat
« Reply #78 - Posted 2012-09-04 23:39:34 »

I've made a new gameplay video, here it is :

<a href=";hl=en_US&amp;start=" target="_blank">;hl=en_US&amp;start=</a>

CTF and Domination gamemodes would work nice too.

I agree ! Smiley

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Offline ra4king

JGO Kernel

Medals: 389
Projects: 3
Exp: 5 years

I'm the King!

« Reply #79 - Posted 2012-09-05 00:03:33 »

Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked O______O

Now THAT is a quality game. You'll make millions, son.

Offline ctomni231

JGO Wizard

Medals: 99
Projects: 1
Exp: 7 years

Not a glitch. Just have a lil' pixelexia...

« Reply #80 - Posted 2012-09-05 02:56:36 »

I played the game. It is very top notch and looks professional.

The only thing I suggest is an aiming cursor. Even if you won't do it for server game implementations, make it an option for local game so beginners can get used to the aiming controls and how they work. (This game controls a lot differently from Crimsonland... but, it is very enjoyable none-the-less.) Keep it up!

Offline Damocles
« Reply #81 - Posted 2012-09-05 07:15:44 »

I think once there are more limits in the gameplay, the game will be more
dynamic and fun.

-weapon, ammo, health picksups
-transporters / portals
-force field doors that go on and off in a specific sequence(where you can see though, but not shoot though)
-jumppads?, where you somehow get accelerated to a new x,y position

-maybe a 3rd dimension in the sense of platforms:
what I mean are areas that can be accessed from the floor plane though staircases,
tranporters and jumppads.
On the platform the player can jump down any time.

Around the platform is an area marked as "too low" in the sense,
that you can not shoot (and look) from the floor onto the platform from there as you are too close
to shoot from this angle.
From the platform you can shoot down, except onto the marked area.
when not beeing directly at the edge.

This gives the game another cover dynamic and movement limit apart from the  walls/corners.

Offline ReBirth
« Reply #82 - Posted 2012-09-05 12:48:42 »

Okay here's my promised suggestion:

Remember the last used weapon Grin I love 2xshot. Oh, flashlight default on will be good too.

Offline sproingie

JGO Kernel

Medals: 202

« Reply #83 - Posted 2012-09-05 18:22:07 »

Environmental hazards would be nice, not just as a hazard for the player, but usable against opponents too.  Sending them flying into spikes, saw blades, flames, acid, live wires, bottomless pits, luring them next to pop-up turrets, that sort of fun stuff Smiley
Offline Tim Spekler

« JGO Spiffy Duke »

Medals: 58
Projects: 2
Exp: 4 years

« Reply #84 - Posted 2012-09-05 20:37:08 »

It's a really really nice work! I did not find the "easy" AI hard at all (but maybe I'm too good  Cool (or maybe you lowered the level))
I like the fact that you put the game in fullscreen mode when it starts. Yet I don't know if people like that generally ?..
I'll follow your project progress Wink
Offline ReBirth
« Reply #85 - Posted 2012-09-06 02:52:09 »

lol easy? I play medium all time, at worst case finish on 3rd :p

Online Jimmt
« League of Dukes »

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Medals: 162
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Exp: 3 years

« Reply #86 - Posted 2012-09-06 04:38:06 »

Just tried the game, very nice. Love the lighting effects, only (minor) complaint is that the player sprite could be improved. But awesome overall.
Offline ReBirth
« Reply #87 - Posted 2012-09-06 04:49:04 »

A campaign can be made too I think, for single player purpose.

Offline deathpat
« Reply #88 - Posted 2012-09-06 16:56:37 »

great, thanks all for your comments ! Smiley

hehe, may the gaming gods hear you ! Wink

I'm currently trying to implement one ... it's not easy to have something at the same time nice looking, not too big/noticeable on the screen and still usefull ( but not too much, otherwise it would be too easy Cheesy ). I'll post a screenshot in a few hours Smiley

in order :
- yes for sure ! health pickup is already done, ammo + weapon pickup will come soon ( I think it's the next thing I'll implement after the crosshair ). I plan to have the same kind of behavior as in Quake 3 : start with default weapon(s) ( they will depend on the map ) and then pick up additional ones. On repawn revert to the default ones ...
- that's indeed a good idea, I'll keep it in mind !
- good idea as well, but I have lots of things to do as prerequisite ... most of them in the map editor Smiley
- acceleration pads could be fun, I'll keep them in mind as well
- 3rd dimension is something I excluded from the beginning, thinking it would be too ambitious. I had to put boundaries to the project to be able to get to the end, and this was one of the boundaries Smiley So I think I'll stay away from it  ... maybe in a V2 Smiley

- remembering the last weapon will certainly become useless after the weapon/ammo system will be finished as you will loose almost all your weapons on respawn Smiley
- yes why not for flashlight default on Smiley Keep in mind that the bots are aware of the light level ... so you can hide in the dark ... unless you have your flashlight on Wink
- for the campaign, maybe I'll do something like a sequence of challenges versus bots on different maps ... for sure I will not do a classic solo game ( with a scenario and so on ... ), it would be too much work for me Smiley

- some of these sound quite feasible, I'll keep them in mind Wink This should be used carrefuly I think otherwise the map could become a big mess Cheesy

@Tim Spekler:
- nope I didn't lowered anything Smiley
- I default to fullscreen on first launch because to me it's the way almost all desktop PC games are doing ... but then I have no idea if people like that Smiley

- I completely agree, I still have some progress to do to draw correctly the player from top view ... maybe I'll render something from a 3d model as a reference because I have difficulties to visualize how a marines looks from top Cheesy

Thanks again for all your comments and suggestions, it helps a lot to keep me motivated ! Wink

work in progress : D A E D A L U S
Offline StumpyStrust
« Reply #89 - Posted 2012-09-06 19:12:03 »

Keep the full screen default. It is more professional.  Cool Almost all AAA games for PC these days go right to full screen. Right now your game looks A^3. It kinda feels like unreal tournament but 2d.

My only gripe which is a personal one would be the camera. I cannot play for longer then 5 minutes before getting sick because the whole screen rotates with the camera. It would not be as bad if the guy was more centered and not like at the edge. I know that you want people to be able to sneak up behind you without knowing but I just can't stand it. I don't think others are like me so no need to really give it much thought but maybe have some options on how the camera works. Other then that, everything looks great. Keep up the work.  Grin

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