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  Nokia and Microsoft wants to compete with Apple and Google  (Read 4634 times)
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Offline Mads

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« Posted 2011-02-13 15:08:41 »

Please note before reading this that this is my own opinion, and we might not share the same views.


Yep, that's right!

Both have made some seriously bad attempts at joining the smartphone scene, but without any luck.
Microsoft have made the software Windows 7 Phone, and Nokia have made a wide variety of touch-phones, where only some can download applications from a market called the Ovi market, which I without knowing, guess is pretty emtpy.

After what I've read this new smartphone should compete with Apple's iPhone, and Google's Android OS.
That sounds successful doesn't it? Really? No?

They say they will split up the work so Microsoft will make the software, and Nokia will make the hardware (what else?  Tongue).

I only see two "small" issues with their plan. Firstly, Microsoft doesn't make very good software, compared to other companies. Secondly, Nokia doesn't make very good hardware compared to other companies in this field.

What do you think? I think this is probably the worst plan to dominate the smartphone market, ever!
The only thing that would make me like this would be a freaking epic product that supports Flash and Java, and it's limited by the software.

Offline Captain Awesome

Junior Member


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Hi


« Reply #1 - Posted 2011-02-13 15:22:15 »

Firstly, Microsoft doesn't make very good software, compared to other companies.

Well, a lot of their software is not very good, but you can't ignore that Windows (especially Windows 7 [for pc]) is one of the best os's on the market today, the only real limitation is the hardware you're using (unlike som other companies who censors and removes applications they don't want their customers to use).

Won't say anything about nokia since I haven't used their phones since the 3330 was a new phone.

But I do agree on the smartphones, I don't think this is a good thing to do and it will probably fail.
Offline gouessej
« Reply #2 - Posted 2011-02-13 16:41:13 »

Please note before reading this that this is my own opinion, and we might not share the same views.

I share your views. Microsoft is a successful crap maker. Nokia should have gone on working on Meego with Intel AND should have provided J2SE For Embedded on its N900. Microsoft and Nokia will make some crapphones together  Grin Android would have been a better option than Windows Phone.

but you can't ignore that Windows (especially Windows 7 [for pc]) is one of the best os's on the market today
This crappy OS fails when I plug my USB key in  Grin epic, isn't it? Almost the same bugs than Vista. This is not what I call a good OS.

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Offline Captain Awesome

Junior Member


Medals: 2


Hi


« Reply #3 - Posted 2011-02-13 17:33:13 »

but you can't ignore that Windows (especially Windows 7 [for pc]) is one of the best os's on the market today
This crappy OS fails when I plug my USB key in  Grin epic, isn't it? Almost the same bugs than Vista. This is not what I call a good OS.

If it doesn't work for you, but it works for everyone else, then it's obviously your own fault. Don't click on "sexy_porn.exe"  Grin

Vista was crap though, no argument there
Offline princec

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« Reply #4 - Posted 2011-02-13 23:17:13 »

Hm I think Microsoft make by and large, very good software. However they've not quite worked out the phone thing. And they are far too late to the party now.

Cas Smiley

Offline kappa
« League of Dukes »

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« Reply #5 - Posted 2011-02-14 00:21:37 »

Its a shame really, Meego and QT were starting to shape up pretty nicely (as an open platform). Nokia will likely kill their support for those now.
Offline appel

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« Reply #6 - Posted 2011-02-14 01:10:39 »

Hm I think Microsoft make by and large, very good software. However they've not quite worked out the phone thing. And they are far too late to the party now.

Cas Smiley

The problem with Microsoft is that they're trying to stick their Windows OS where it's not appropriate.

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Offline kappa
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« Reply #7 - Posted 2011-02-14 01:22:45 »

The problem with Microsoft is that they're trying to stick their Windows OS where it's not appropriate.

Its pretty clear that in future a ton of the computing devices and tasks done on the desktop will be portable and this is a serious threat to Microsoft's desktop dominance. They'll push very hard to get a strong foothold in the mobile market.
Offline philfrei
« Reply #8 - Posted 2011-02-14 05:49:11 »

I've had a fair bit of experience with MS Access and Visual Basic for Applications. I seriously dislike Microsoft, for a number of reasons. But I will grant that the IDE for building forms and reports for database applications is stronger than, say, the NetBeans graphical interface. Visual Studio is also very well done. It's a mixed bag, really.

They're a lot more likely to enable C# than any sort of Java implementation, don't you think? Maybe it depends which of the dueling MS fiefdoms has been tasked.

I was riding home on BART the other day and over half the people were staring at various phones, and it seemed like half of those were playing games. It's a huge market, still growing. Huge opportunity lost if MS doesn't get going there, I would think.

"Greetings my friends! We are all interested in the future, for that is where you and I are going to spend the rest of our lives!" -- The Amazing Criswell
Offline OverKill

Junior Member




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« Reply #9 - Posted 2011-02-14 08:29:43 »

While Nokia devices certainly had the bling back in the days, their OSs were terrible. Maybe not as bad as the 'cheap' Samsungs, Sagems or LGs but not far behind either.

And, well M$ speaks for itself, or?

IMHO watching them fail will be great show.
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Offline kappa
« League of Dukes »

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« Reply #10 - Posted 2011-02-14 11:37:30 »

On Friday after Nokia announced the deal with MS, it lost $17 billion of its share price, Ouch!

source
Offline gouessej
« Reply #11 - Posted 2011-02-14 13:01:24 »

If it doesn't work for you, but it works for everyone else, then it's obviously your own fault.
No it is not my fault, the same key works fine with Windows XP, Mac OS X and Linux. I'm not the only one in this case. Vista and 7 have a lot of bugs especially in their file system implementation even though 7 has less bad performances.

Offline Roquen
« Reply #12 - Posted 2011-02-14 13:53:11 »

What bugs would that be?
Offline princec

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« Reply #13 - Posted 2011-02-14 15:07:17 »

Just FUD. Windows NT-based OSes are rock solid.

Cas Smiley

Offline gouessej
« Reply #14 - Posted 2011-02-15 11:56:10 »

Just FUD. Windows NT-based OSes are rock solid.

Cas Smiley
Sorry but FUD is your speciality, not mine. These freezes happen with some USB keys built by EMTEC and Transcend. Some other people have the same problem here:
http://www.windows-vista-update.com/windows-vista-freezes-after-a-usb-flash-drive-is-inserted-comments.html

Offline Roquen
« Reply #15 - Posted 2011-02-15 12:50:52 »

Well, that's not a lot of information, but I'd be willing to bet this is a faulty driver (perhaps in conjunction with multiple USB and/or plug-and-play devices creating a conflict).  And issues like this are not really related to the kernel of a given OS.
Offline princec

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Projects: 3
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« Reply #16 - Posted 2011-02-15 13:33:23 »

I don't recall being a specialist in any of fear, uncertainty or doubt. I thought I usually gave people advice about what's definitely working usually...?
So what's this vendor's broken kernel level driver got to do with the stability of Windows NT - I'm dying to know. Y'know, I bet it was those same shithead coders that wrote them that also made those ATI drivers that crash all my games on Ubuntu.

Cas Smiley

Offline bobjob

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David Aaron Muhar


« Reply #17 - Posted 2011-02-15 13:50:48 »

I thought I usually gave people advice about what's definitely working usually...?
Thought, only thought, are you doubting yourself?
Usually, that sounds a little uncertain.
So what is it that your afraid of?

Tongue

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Offline princec

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« Reply #18 - Posted 2011-02-15 13:58:52 »

Occasionally I have really shitty days where I wish Java would just DIE and think that the only useful computer ever invented was the cash dispenser. But they are rare  Roll Eyes

Cas Smiley

Offline Orangy Tang

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Monkey for a head


« Reply #19 - Posted 2011-02-15 14:32:00 »

Occasionally I have really shitty days where I wish Java would just DIE and think that the only useful computer ever invented was the cash dispenser. But they are rare  Roll Eyes

Cas Smiley

Quote
I have always wished for my computer to be as easy to use as my telephone; my wish has come true because I can no longer figure out how to use my telephone.

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Offline appel

JGO Wizard


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I always win!


« Reply #20 - Posted 2011-02-15 15:06:23 »

Well, this seems like the general trend. Cellphone manufacturers no longer make the OS, but rather get the OS from another company, after all these modern phones are almost like PC's so why wouldn't it evolve like the PC market? You don't see HP making their own OS, or Microsoft making their own computers. Soon you will be able to decide what OS you want on your phone when you buy it. This is true even today, as many manufacturers offer phones with different OS's.

Apple is unique in this aspect, and will probably continue to be so.

But I think Nokia is just following the trend. It's a correct decision for them to make, considering the situation they are in. But they shouldn't have locked themselves in with just one OS vendor, however, they probably got a sweet deal on Windows Phone 7 OS. In the short term it might save them, but in the long run it might hinder them.

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Offline Eli Delventhal

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« Reply #21 - Posted 2011-02-15 15:49:40 »

Remember that the mobile market is not a single market - it's several. Apple has the gadget whore techophile gadget cornered with their beautiful and well-behaving devices, but their high price point will keep them there. Android is going for a wider audience, but I think there is still room for Windows devices to be marketed as the cheapest devices. Right now it's very expensive to get any smart phone - if they could pull it down to be closer to the price range of what non-smartphones are currently going for then they might be able to carve out part of the market.

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Offline Nate

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Esoteric Software


« Reply #22 - Posted 2011-02-15 20:46:17 »

The problem with Microsoft is that they're trying to stick their Windows OS where it's not appropriate.
Show us on the doll where they tried to stick it...  Shocked

Offline gouessej
« Reply #23 - Posted 2011-02-17 15:43:32 »

Well, that's not a lot of information, but I'd be willing to bet this is a faulty driver (perhaps in conjunction with multiple USB and/or plug-and-play devices creating a conflict).  And issues like this are not really related to the kernel of a given OS.
I'm sceptical as these keys were working even with XP. If you're right, they introduced a regression in their drivers for Vista and 7.

Offline Roquen
« Reply #24 - Posted 2011-02-23 07:31:38 »

Not at all.  Try re-reading my post.
Offline kaffiene
« Reply #25 - Posted 2011-02-23 22:15:18 »


They say they will split up the work so Microsoft will make the software, and Nokia will make the hardware (what else?  Tongue).

I only see two "small" issues with their plan. Firstly, Microsoft doesn't make very good software, compared to other companies. Secondly, Nokia doesn't make very good hardware compared to other companies in this field.


I disagree with you.  I personally loathe M$, but by all accounts, their new mobile OS (can't remember what they're calling it - W7?) is really good.  I've read a few reviews and they were all positive.  Nokia have a tonne of experience producing hardware. They ship more if it than anyone else and most of it is pretty solid.  Their challenge is that they have targeted the low end of the market.  They need to move up the complexity scale and that will be a challenge.

I think they will probably fail but that's because I think that iPhone and Android will be hard to compete with - they already have a large part of the market and represent two different segments of the market.  That makes it hard for a newcomer to compete - they have to be significantly better in some way or find a niche that the two incumbents do not currently cover.

While I would like to deride M$ products, it appears the facts (rather than what our prejudices would like us to believe) are that they've done a reasonable job in this area.  Still think they'll fail thou - for marketing, not technical reasons.
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