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Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Posted 2010-10-04 19:34:37 »

I am new to this site, and thought it would be interesting to be with this community(:
I'm very new with all this, so don't hate me! >.<
I want to learn, and started learning last week! Going through tutorials and everything.

I intentionally want to create games for the Android market, and I was told java is a great way to start off since I have no knowledge with game development.

Actually me and my friend who is several hours away, we both are learning it, I kind of dragged him in the learning curve with me and glad I did. I realize this sort of thing can be dismotivating sometimes and other things, but I want to follow through.

If you want to know exactly what I know which is nothing compared to you guys, but just learning basic codings with class and methods ect.

I just want to b able to ask noob noob questions on here and get nice simple answers from time to time.


About myself: I'm 19 years old, taking Digital Design in a technical school, wanting to create some cool games for people.

This Java thing seems pretty complicated but hopefully it's not as hard as it seems. I'd take any advice from you guys, anything at all really.
Thanks!

-Wing
Offline DzzD
« Reply #1 - Posted 2010-10-04 19:38:00 »

Welcome Wingless ! you just land on the best Java forum Smiley

Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #2 - Posted 2010-10-04 19:59:22 »

Thank you! Any advice/ comments would be appreciated (:
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline princec

JGO Kernel


Medals: 342
Projects: 3
Exp: 16 years


Eh? Who? What? ... Me?


« Reply #3 - Posted 2010-10-04 21:42:15 »

By "best" he means "only", too Smiley

Cas Smiley

Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #4 - Posted 2010-10-04 22:04:53 »

Hey I just played like 5 levels of your RoT game, pretty fun stuff. I hope to have skills as you someday sir (:
Offline CaptainJester

JGO Knight


Medals: 12
Projects: 2
Exp: 14 years


Make it work; make it better.


« Reply #5 - Posted 2010-10-04 22:14:21 »

I always recommend that anyone starting with Java read the entire The Java Tutorial.  A lot of questions beginners ask on this forum are answered in there.

Offline Eli Delventhal

JGO Kernel


Medals: 42
Projects: 11
Exp: 10 years


Game Engineer


« Reply #6 - Posted 2010-10-04 22:34:36 »

In general, start simple and ramp your way up from there. Do the Hello World thing first. And don't mess with OpenGL or anything like that until you're totally comfortable with Java2D.

Don't make an MMORPG.

See my work:
OTC Software
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #7 - Posted 2010-10-04 23:30:26 »

In general, start simple and ramp your way up from there. Do the Hello World thing first. And don't mess with OpenGL or anything like that until you're totally comfortable with Java2D.

Don't make an MMORPG.
Thank you, and I did the Hello World thing, that was the first thing I did.
And ya I'll I'm doing is 2D Java, then worry about everything later. (:
Offline Nate

JGO Kernel


Medals: 145
Projects: 4
Exp: 14 years


Esoteric Software


« Reply #8 - Posted 2010-10-05 02:33:49 »

http://math.hws.edu/javanotes/

Offline bobjob

JGO Knight


Medals: 10
Projects: 4


David Aaron Muhar


« Reply #9 - Posted 2010-10-05 02:57:26 »

1  
This Java thing seems pretty complicated but hopefully it's not as hard as it seems. I'd take any advice from you guys, anything at all really

I think you will be surprised with how simple java is once you understand the concept of object oriented programming (simpler than it sounds)

one good thing to look at before moving into the language core programming, is to decide on a good IDE.

for the sake of learning you might want to start with something like blueJ, (great for understanding).
but then once you get how code interacts with other code in java move to a proper IDE.

My Projects
Games, Webcam chat, Video screencast, PDF tools.

Javagaming.org with chat room
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #10 - Posted 2010-10-05 14:08:52 »

Thanks I'll read some of that and see how useful it is compared to others (:
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #11 - Posted 2010-10-05 14:10:56 »

1  
This Java thing seems pretty complicated but hopefully it's not as hard as it seems. I'd take any advice from you guys, anything at all really

I think you will be surprised with how simple java is once you understand the concept of object oriented programming (simpler than it sounds)

one good thing to look at before moving into the language core programming, is to decide on a good IDE.

for the sake of learning you might want to start with something like blueJ, (great for understanding).
but then once you get how code interacts with other code in java move to a proper IDE.
Well I started Java to learn everything before moving to Android. Another step back? lol
I'm learning everyday about java, but pretty much I'm only learning things right now about inputs/scanner/variables
.

And what you mean choose an IDE? And are there more recommended ones than others? Thanks!
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





.
« Reply #12 - Posted 2010-10-05 19:00:51 »

Hey guys, as for a java basic game after I learn some things and start creating cheap practice games, I'm wanting to make something very simple (since i won't be good with anything really yet so son't care about prettyness yet lol) and addicting. I always loved the simple yet addicting games, and thats probably the stuff I will do, especially to start with.

I want to know how simple those "simple" games are though. For example "the hardest game ever" game has that addicting feel to it, but so simple looking. And I know it's probably not made in java but flash I'm guessing, but COULD it be made in java the same way and is it really as simple as it looks?
Another game that comes to mind is the "3D Missile" game. I Use to like several years ago, and has the same feel.

Thanks!
Offline Eli Delventhal

JGO Kernel


Medals: 42
Projects: 11
Exp: 10 years


Game Engineer


« Reply #13 - Posted 2010-10-05 19:05:14 »

You can make anything in Java. And you can make pretty much anything in Flash. Don't focus on the language, just decide exactly what you want to do and do it.

See my work:
OTC Software
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #14 - Posted 2010-10-05 19:09:08 »

You can make anything in Java. And you can make pretty much anything in Flash. Don't focus on the language, just decide exactly what you want to do and do it.
I'll do my best, but right now I don't know how to do it. All i can do it learn the coding and then learn how to make things happen and everything, ughhh
Offline Draps

Senior Newbie





« Reply #15 - Posted 2010-10-06 03:22:25 »

Ok well, im assuming by some of the things you say for example not know what and IDE is but that's ok we al didn't when we started heh.

i myself am 18  and have been doing c# for 2 years, I have basic experience with c++ and python + some web languages (HTML, CSS, PHP and a little JS. i just recently started java, i didn't find it too hard as it is same structure as c#. As far as games go I used GML(Game Maker Language) to create a lot of 2D and 3D games a lot of cool particle effects and AI.

For a beginner to object orientated programming like Java. the best thing to do is to just play.
Read tutorials on certain things, and don’t be afraid to read other peoples code.. However if you are going to use the code ask the owner and give credit or at least give credit.

Always practice things you learn.
i know its seams a waste of time when it comes to it but you will be grateful in the future. for example if you learn how to do a for loop for the first time, practice it a couple of times re write it, and play with the values, explore what you can do with what you have. and make some fun of it. Stress test your program.


be persistent and don’t be afraid to ask questions. When you code, other people observing your code will find it easier (generally) to find mistakes.
well in my opinion any way.

Draps.
Offline SwampChicken
« Reply #16 - Posted 2010-10-06 05:52:07 »

I think you should try making a simple shoot'em up first.
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #17 - Posted 2010-10-06 15:06:40 »

Ok well, im assuming by some of the things you say for example not know what and IDE is but that's ok we al didn't when we started heh.

i myself am 18  and have been doing c# for 2 years, I have basic experience with c++ and python + some web languages (HTML, CSS, PHP and a little JS. i just recently started java, i didn't find it too hard as it is same structure as c#. As far as games go I used GML(Game Maker Language) to create a lot of 2D and 3D games a lot of cool particle effects and AI.

For a beginner to object orientated programming like Java. the best thing to do is to just play.
Read tutorials on certain things, and don’t be afraid to read other peoples code.. However if you are going to use the code ask the owner and give credit or at least give credit.

Always practice things you learn.
i know its seams a waste of time when it comes to it but you will be grateful in the future. for example if you learn how to do a for loop for the first time, practice it a couple of times re write it, and play with the values, explore what you can do with what you have. and make some fun of it. Stress test your program.


be persistent and don’t be afraid to ask questions. When you code, other people observing your code will find it easier (generally) to find mistakes.
well in my opinion any way.

Draps.

Thanks! It is complicated and I'm trying my best, and will follow through tutorials.

Is java better than GML? And why java over other programs (excluding the being easier part. I'd stick to it just because it's easier to learn the basics though anyways)

Anyone can help answer me, it's kind of exciting starting all this and thinking of games you can make.



Do you experienced developers still get excited when doing things with your game, or even just thinking of a cool game  idea to make, or is it just me being noobish and just wanting to learn already? lol


And another question (sorry!) but I'm learning about variables and scanner and calculator right now, you guys use all this in all the games? Thanks you guys are great I like this helpful community, wish it was a little more populated though.
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #18 - Posted 2010-10-06 15:08:31 »

I think you should try making a simple shoot'em up first.
like that Battle Bears game in the Android Market, but a LOT cheaper? Or a cheap platforming shooting game?
Online cylab

JGO Ninja


Medals: 38



« Reply #19 - Posted 2010-10-06 15:20:43 »

like that Battle Bears game in the Android Market, but a LOT cheaper? Or a cheap platforming shooting game?
Do Spaceinvaders 101 - 103. Leave out the OpenGL/LWJGL stuff for later.

Mathias - I Know What [you] Did Last Summer!
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #20 - Posted 2010-10-06 19:00:33 »

Do Spaceinvaders 101 - 103. Leave out the OpenGL/LWJGL stuff for later.
This is brilliant thanks (:

I have a question about the coding he uses. Are those codes the same what everyone kind of uses? like:

long delta = System.currentTimeMillis() - lastLoopTime;
   lastLoopTime = System.currentTimeMillis();

and

g.dispose();
   strategy.show();

and

try { Thread.sleep(10); } catch (Exception e) {}

and

JPanel panel = (JPanel) container.getContentPane();
panel.setPreferredSize(new Dimension(800,600));
panel.setLayout(null);
      

The names he uses that make the game work, are they the same with any coding? Like for your loops, do you use "lastLoopTime" exactly for that specific behavior?
Is it like a lot of memorization to know all these exact codings to know what to do with it, or is he making those codings the way they are?
Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 743
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #21 - Posted 2010-10-06 19:30:20 »

The names he uses that make the game work, are they the same with any coding? Like for your loops, do you use "lastLoopTime" exactly for that specific behavior?

It's a variable.

You can define them, assign values to them, and read them back.

Learn Java (or how to program in almost any language) first... buy a book. You'll be much better off.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #22 - Posted 2010-10-06 19:47:26 »

It's a variable.

You can define them, assign values to them, and read them back.

Learn Java (or how to program in almost any language) first... buy a book. You'll be much better off.
I understand, and I am learning about variables and inputs and stuff. I understand that variables can be assigned, thats what you do with the equal sign, just like in math class x=8 ect.

Using this as my question/ explanation:

long delta = System.currentTimeMillis() - lastLoopTime;
   lastLoopTime = System.currentTimeMillis();


Ok so I think I kind of get it. In the post I replied to last, "System.currentTimeMillis()" is really something that java can recognize? And he sets (what HE made up) "lastLoopTime" as the variable so he understands what that behavior is be naming it that?


Is it something like that? And if "long delta = System.currentTimeMillis() - lastLoopTime" but "lastLoopTime = System.currentTimeMillis()" don't they cancel out (is that even a minus sign or is it just indicating that the System.currentTimeMillis is the lastLoopTime??"


Or am I thinking to much lol sorry
Offline Eli Delventhal

JGO Kernel


Medals: 42
Projects: 11
Exp: 10 years


Game Engineer


« Reply #23 - Posted 2010-10-06 19:56:18 »

Check out the java docs: http://download.oracle.com/javase/6/docs/api/

Then look for the System class, then look for currentTimeMillis() within it. If he's calling any method that he didn't create himself, that means he's calling a Java method (or a method from a library he uses in the case of the OpenGL version stay away from that version for a long while).

System.currentTimeMillis() gives you the current time in milliseconds since Jan 1, 1970. That means when he calls it twice, he is measuring the time between when he first called it and when he called it the second time. You can use that value to decide how much to update your game (the delta).

See my work:
OTC Software
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #24 - Posted 2010-10-06 21:32:42 »

Check out the java docs: http://download.oracle.com/javase/6/docs/api/

Then look for the System class, then look for currentTimeMillis() within it. If he's calling any method that he didn't create himself, that means he's calling a Java method (or a method from a library he uses in the case of the OpenGL version stay away from that version for a long while).

System.currentTimeMillis() gives you the current time in milliseconds since Jan 1, 1970. That means when he calls it twice, he is measuring the time between when he first called it and when he called it the second time. You can use that value to decide how much to update your game (the delta).
So was I totally wrong then?

And thanks I appreciate your post!
May I ask why OpenGL I should stay far away from? I wiki'd it before but of course I don't understand it completely yet.

Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 743
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #25 - Posted 2010-10-06 21:39:04 »

Or am I thinking to much lol sorry

Let's image you haven't asked any question, and start over:


What would you do if you'd move to another country, let's say France. How would you learn the language? Chatting with the local baker, with hands and feet, maybe looking a few words up on a dictionary, and hope the best of it, or would you learn the language properly.

You're attempting to write poetry in French. Lets' face it, it's not going to happen, without a major investment in the language first.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #26 - Posted 2010-10-06 21:50:23 »

Let's image you haven't asked any question, and start over:


What would you do if you'd move to another country, let's say France. How would you learn the language? Chatting with the local baker, with hands and feet, maybe looking a few words up on a dictionary, and hope the best of it, or would you learn the language properly.

You're attempting to write poetry in French. Lets' face it, it's not going to happen, without a major investment in the language first.
I realize where you are going at, but I am trying to learn the best ways possible with tutorials and following things and learning about basics, and read codings to see how and why things work, ect
Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 743
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #27 - Posted 2010-10-06 23:29:10 »

Your 'tactics' will waste a lot of time. Surely, if you have that time, you can get better and better, and maybe eventually gain some skills, but you could have spent the same time mastering it.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
Offline Wingless

Senior Newbie





« Reply #28 - Posted 2010-10-06 23:34:07 »

Your 'tactics' will waste a lot of time. Surely, if you have that time, you can get better and better, and maybe eventually gain some skills, but you could have spent the same time mastering it.
So what you want me to do exactly??
Offline Riven
« League of Dukes »

JGO Overlord


Medals: 743
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #29 - Posted 2010-10-06 23:37:46 »

Buy a book, study it, don't turn the page until you grasp what's on that page. Write your 'Hello World' program, slowly write more complex programs, preferably not with a GUI. Master the language first, after that, try to make a window with buttons, etc. Don't skip any parts, it might take a few months and you can maybe even show us a command-line game! Once the logic works, try to turn it into a GUI, where you paint things, and catch key-events. Yay! After that the possibilities are endless.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social rankings
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