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  Good news for Java mobile devs?  (Read 5123 times)
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Offline TheAnalogKid

JGO Coder


Projects: 2



« Posted 2010-09-14 17:15:08 »

If you're still in mobile Java dev but outside Android, Nokia has some good news for you:

http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/nokia_to_developers_consumers_are_hungry_for_java.php

Offline TheAnalogKid

JGO Coder


Projects: 2



« Reply #1 - Posted 2010-09-16 15:14:22 »

outch!

Online Riven
« League of Dukes »

« JGO Overlord »


Medals: 848
Projects: 4
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Hand over your head.


« Reply #2 - Posted 2010-09-17 08:35:15 »

You didn't ask any question, did not request feedback, you just posted a link, so what's the point in bumping?

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Offline ryanm

Senior Devvie


Projects: 1
Exp: 15 years


Used to be bleb


« Reply #3 - Posted 2010-09-17 08:46:39 »

Deleted spam post, trying to appear relevant by spouting made-up statistics on Nokia's market-share
Offline TheAnalogKid

JGO Coder


Projects: 2



« Reply #4 - Posted 2010-09-17 13:07:02 »

This is just to inform those who might be interested in Java mobile dev with Nokia. I just want to help people you know. Any issue with that?

Online Riven
« League of Dukes »

« JGO Overlord »


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Hand over your head.


« Reply #5 - Posted 2010-09-17 13:33:46 »

This is just a misunderstanding.

Your 'outch!' post looked like a bump, but it (apparently) was a reply to a removed spam post.

If you prefer, this thread can be cleaned up, keeping the original post.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social
Offline TheAnalogKid

JGO Coder


Projects: 2



« Reply #6 - Posted 2010-09-17 13:37:50 »

You're right! I remember someone here posted a reply saying that Nokia has serious financial difficulties and such. Sorry for my misunderstanding.  Undecided

Offline Nate

« JGO Bitwise Duke »


Medals: 158
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Esoteric Software


« Reply #7 - Posted 2010-09-17 23:13:24 »

Ouch! Tongue

Online Riven
« League of Dukes »

« JGO Overlord »


Medals: 848
Projects: 4
Exp: 16 years


Hand over your head.


« Reply #8 - Posted 2010-09-17 23:15:48 »

Ouch! Tongue

Your comments have been inspirational lately.

Hi, appreciate more people! Σ ♥ = ¾
Learn how to award medals... and work your way up the social
Offline TheAnalogKid

JGO Coder


Projects: 2



« Reply #9 - Posted 2010-09-17 23:47:30 »

Ouch! Tongue
Yeah, Yeah! ;-)

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Offline OverKill

Junior Devvie




Java games rock!


« Reply #10 - Posted 2010-09-20 07:18:21 »

@Topic:
* Didn't Nokia plan to drop it's mobile phones?
* J2ME is dead man, it's dead.
* developing something for the platform of ONE phone that does not own the market makes little sense (compared to iPhone f.i.).
  dunno Nokia's market share ATM but a few years ago they had about 20ish. Of those you have to calculate out the ones that would be interested and out of those the ones willing to buy them.

There was a reason the J2ME mobile market was the way it was. You had to have a large market base and many resellers if you wanted to make money.
Those times are gone, at least for J2ME.
Offline zammbi

JGO Coder


Medals: 4



« Reply #11 - Posted 2010-09-20 09:26:14 »

Well I hope to see J2ME learn from Android and improve it or see JavaFX on phones. There is also the Java market which I hope would help.
Windows mobile 7 started from scratch to get back into the race against android and iPhone, so why can't anyone else?

Myself I still like to see able writing one application for windows/android/symbian.

Current project - Rename and Sort
Offline dime

Senior Newbie





« Reply #12 - Posted 2010-09-22 22:32:30 »

Well I hope to see J2ME learn from Android and improve it or see JavaFX on phones. There is also the Java market which I hope would help.
Windows mobile 7 started from scratch to get back into the race against android and iPhone, so why can't anyone else?

Myself I still like to see able writing one application for windows/android/symbian.

I wish they would just create a Java Apps store.  Any user from any system, Desktop (win,linux,mac), Mobile, web, etc could download an app and be assured that it works on their platform.  For developers, they would have one place to push and it'd work on all platforms.  This of course assumes that you have a reasonable and working environment on each platform, which we really don't.  I don't buy this "write once, run everywhere" nonsense.

Offline Mordan

Junior Devvie





« Reply #13 - Posted 2010-10-15 20:41:26 »

I wish they would just create a Java Apps store.  Any user from any system, Desktop (win,linux,mac), Mobile, web, etc could download an app and be assured that it works on their platform.  For developers, they would have one place to push and it'd work on all platforms.  This of course assumes that you have a reasonable and working environment on each platform, which we really don't.  I don't buy this "write once, run everywhere" nonsense.



Right about the beginning

However I buy it. You just need to actually implement a strict test process to test java implementations of the APIs. That was never done and resulted in fragmentation.

I love J2ME. I write code for J2ME in Eclipse and I can port it with NO CHANGES AT ALL and it runs on J2SE with just a few class to bridge the MIDlet and Canvas classes? How do you call this? That's what I call Sun's magic that Google tried to stain with Dalvik.
I would love to have a Java for Console using exactly the same bytecode and same basic API.
So YES Write Once Run Everywhere is possible.
Offline Nate

« JGO Bitwise Duke »


Medals: 158
Projects: 4
Exp: 14 years


Esoteric Software


« Reply #14 - Posted 2010-10-16 02:50:42 »

* Nate sloooowly backs away from Mordan...

Offline Mordan

Junior Devvie





« Reply #15 - Posted 2010-10-16 20:40:21 »

* Nate sloooowly backs away from Mordan...

what's your problem? I'm ready to take it. come on.
Offline Nate

« JGO Bitwise Duke »


Medals: 158
Projects: 4
Exp: 14 years


Esoteric Software


« Reply #16 - Posted 2010-10-17 07:12:28 »

Eh, your rant was pretty nuts. Smiley

A Java store exists and is crap. J2ME sucks. I can see pining for J2SE on mobile, but not J2ME. Google is doing a good thing for Java and for the mobile space, and doing it better than Sun can/could/tried. Write-once-run-everywhere hardly works even for J2SE. Try something like Java Sound on a Mac...

Offline Scarzzurs
« Reply #17 - Posted 2010-10-17 11:34:33 »

Ahem... try Java Sound on ANY system...

I've even found ways to reliably cause segmentation fault on Windows using Java Sound when following API rules...
(Yeah yeah, didn't report it. Apparently they had already fixed the bug once, and Java Sound just seemed beyond saving any ways...)

[End Of Rant]
Sorry about that, had to spill it XD

On topic, I think the more focus Java gets the better, although, at least in my country, smart phones seems to be the future...

- Scarzzurs

My games and Projects:
BlastingPixels.com,
Old website
Offline zammbi

JGO Coder


Medals: 4



« Reply #18 - Posted 2010-10-17 11:42:50 »

A Java store exists and is crap. J2ME sucks. I can see pining for J2SE on mobile, but not J2ME. Google is doing a good thing for Java and for the mobile space, and doing it better than Sun can/could/tried.
Well the java store isn't opened yet to the public. Though I have heard no news on it. Hopefully they will release it still. It would help a lot.

As for J2ME, it probably been the best to use before all the new stuff. Hopefully they will improve what android did.

The latest news looks like a good start:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/09/26/mobile_java_oracle/

Current project - Rename and Sort
Offline Mordan

Junior Devvie





« Reply #19 - Posted 2010-10-18 10:11:15 »

while I agree Java Sound (I have no experience in J2SE) may cause problems to some. This particular fault shouldn't let you kill the baby.

I had many gripes with sound in J2ME as well. So while you can't reliably use Wav PCM or any mixing, you can easily program the MIDI chip when the phone supports it.

My main point is this:

I was delighted to see I can write an application/game for J2ME and with the correct J2SE bridge, you can run it on your laptop with the J2SE platform with no changes. Can you do that with Dalvik?

What's great about that? Well practically you send/replicate the jar over bluetooth and send it to your laptop and run the J2ME app/game on your laptop!! That's for me an instance of WriteOnceRunEverywhere? Who disagrees? All you need is an API bridge. You never have to emulate bytecode from a different thing (i.e. dalvik) which always leads to trouble.

Of course the model can still be improved because J2SE Bluetooth support sucks, at least to my knowledge. So the laptop cannot send the app/game to another phone by itself. The user must use the Windows/Linux interface.

Sorry folks, J2ME is the bomb. It forces you to think like those byte gods who programmed the SNES/MegaDrive.
Offline Nate

« JGO Bitwise Duke »


Medals: 158
Projects: 4
Exp: 14 years


Esoteric Software


« Reply #20 - Posted 2010-10-18 19:48:34 »

I was delighted to see I can write an application/game for J2ME and with the correct J2SE bridge, you can run it on your laptop with the J2SE platform with no changes. Can you do that with Dalvik?

What's great about that? Well practically you send/replicate the jar over bluetooth and send it to your laptop and run the J2ME app/game on your laptop!! That's for me an instance of WriteOnceRunEverywhere? Who disagrees? All you need is an API bridge.

The way Dalvik works is this: It takes a bunch of Java bytecodes and converts them to Dalvik format so they run on Android. This is done automatically by an Eclipse plugin. You can take Java projects that were never meant to run on Android, and run them on Android. Eg, I use Apache Lucene (a big project) in one of my Android apps. The entire J2SE JDK is not available on Android, but all the important parts are. J2SE is old and Sun's insistence on never breaking backward compatibility has created a lot of cruft (eg, Swing). Some Sun projects are just bad (eg, RMI). It is easy to write apps that run on both Android and desktop using the same codebase.

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