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  Resistance Force  (Read 44049 times)
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Offline jezek2
« Reply #30 - Posted 2009-11-24 07:02:14 »

hah the pic doesn't show for some reason Cry the error message says :
javaw.exe -Application Error
The instruction at "0x0f00c059" referenced memory at "0x0f17c808". The memory could not be read.
Click Ok to terminate the program(which I did)

What graphics card do you have? Also at which point this error shows? Any logs generated?
Offline jezek2
« Reply #31 - Posted 2009-11-24 07:37:43 »

crash
logs:
1  
2  
3  
4  
5  
...
16:26:07   [debug] OpenGL vendor: ATI Technologies Inc.
16:26:07   [debug] OpenGL renderer: ATI Radeon X300/X550/X1050 Series
16:26:07   [debug] OpenGL driver version: 2.1.7873 Release
...


Thanks for the report, there is unhandled one case when the card doesn't support NPOT textures (will fix in next update). But your card doesn't seem to support Pixel Shaders 2.0a/b or better, so the game wouldn't work anyway.
Offline EgonOlsen
« Reply #32 - Posted 2009-11-24 07:52:50 »

What graphics card do you have? Also at which point this error shows? Any logs generated?
I'm getting the same error on that Intel based machine. It's actually an exception printed to the log (as posted before), but the exe-file crashes with this application error.

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Offline EgonOlsen
« Reply #33 - Posted 2009-11-24 07:54:06 »

Thanks for the report, there is unhandled one case when the card doesn't support NPOT textures (will fix in next update). But your card doesn't seem to support Pixel Shaders 2.0a/b or better, so the game wouldn't work anyway.
X300/X550/X1050 does support pixel shader 2.0. It's the same architecture as the X800, just slower.

Offline jezek2
« Reply #34 - Posted 2009-11-24 08:17:03 »

X300/X550/X1050 does support pixel shader 2.0. It's the same architecture as the X800, just slower.

Yes, but PS2.0a/b is different thing from pure PS2.0, it's more like PS3.0 but missing some features.

PS2.0a - introduced by GeForce FX
PS2.0b - introduced by Radeon X700

Unfortunatelly the X1050 is based on older chip which doesn't support it. See the TOC of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units for details which chip is used for given Radeon products range
Offline jezek2
« Reply #35 - Posted 2009-11-24 08:25:19 »

I'm getting the same error on that Intel based machine. It's actually an exception printed to the log (as posted before), but the exe-file crashes with this application error.

Thanks for information. Old Intel graphic cards are not supported, they have poor performance and not much capabilities. I'll check what's needed to support the newest ones such as the already mentioned GMA 4500HD.
Offline EgonOlsen
« Reply #36 - Posted 2009-11-24 09:32:50 »

Yes, but PS2.0a/b is different thing from pure PS2.0, it's more like PS3.0 but missing some features.

PS2.0a - introduced by GeForce FX
PS2.0b - introduced by Radeon X700

Unfortunatelly the X1050 is based on older chip which doesn't support it. See the TOC of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units for details which chip is used for given Radeon products range
You are right...damn relabeling and renaming... Wink

Offline DoubleBarrel

Senior Newbie





« Reply #37 - Posted 2009-11-24 20:44:09 »

Quote
What graphics card do you have? Also at which point this error shows? Any logs generated?

Nvidia Geforce2 MX/MX 400.
Just when I double click on the executable a window appears with a message saying "checking for updates. After that the error message pops out.

And Java Goes On
Offline jezek2
« Reply #38 - Posted 2009-11-24 21:24:15 »

Nvidia Geforce2 MX/MX 400.
Just when I double click on the executable a window appears with a message saying "checking for updates. After that the error message pops out.

Thanks for information, though this graphics card is far below minimum requirements.
Offline DzzD
« Reply #39 - Posted 2009-11-24 22:24:36 »

nobody here to play Sad

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Offline zammbi

JGO Coder


Medals: 4



« Reply #40 - Posted 2009-11-25 03:23:14 »

Ill kill ya once its supports my graphics card  Wink

Current project - Rename and Sort
Offline h3ckboy

JGO Coder


Medals: 5



« Reply #41 - Posted 2009-11-25 06:31:11 »

looks, really cool, but I experienced the same issue as dzzd Sad.

try putting it on gamejolt maybe?
Offline jezek2
« Reply #42 - Posted 2009-11-25 13:36:31 »

looks, really cool, but I experienced the same issue as dzzd Sad.

Yeah, I'm working on this issue. In the meantime you can use the chat (which is just webchat frontend for IRC so you can join directly too). Ask for game and hang there for awhile.

try putting it on gamejolt maybe?

GameJolt is nice but it doesn't (yet?) support commercial stuff.
Offline h3ckboy

JGO Coder


Medals: 5



« Reply #43 - Posted 2009-11-25 15:19:35 »

yeah, but you can just put it on for now, and in the comment say liek:

"this is just an alpha testing, it will soon be removed do to complete release"
Offline DzzD
« Reply #44 - Posted 2009-11-25 17:41:08 »

yeah, but you can just put it on for now, and in the comment say liek:

"this is just an alpha testing, it will soon be removed do to complete release"

but already a very fun to play Alpha  Smiley

Offline gouessej
« Reply #45 - Posted 2009-11-25 18:56:00 »

Hi!

Thanks for information, though this graphics card is far below minimum requirements.
Do you plan to disable pixel shading on machines with a graphics card below your current minimum requirements? I only have an ATI Radeon 9250 Pro at home, I will try your game on another machine with an Nvidia Quadro FX 3450, I hope it will work.

Offline jezek2
« Reply #46 - Posted 2009-11-25 19:11:04 »

Do you plan to disable pixel shading on machines with a graphics card below your current minimum requirements? I only have an ATI Radeon 9250 Pro at home, I will try your game on another machine with an Nvidia Quadro FX 3450, I hope it will work.

Most likely not. It's true that I've been thinking a bit about creating legacy renderer which would use just fixed function pipeline and not any fancy features for older or slow integrated cards. But it would mean I would have to support two very different renderers and I would have to think about how to create any new effect in both renderers. This would be too much effort for very little gain since even pretty old cards can do decent shaders.

Test on Quadro FX or GeForce FX would be welcome, theoretically it should work too. Probably with blocky ambient because GF FX can't handle bilinear interpolation of float textures. Also someone with Radeon X700 would be helpful too (or any other Radeon card with PS 2.0b).
Offline gouessej
« Reply #47 - Posted 2009-11-25 19:28:24 »

Most likely not. It's true that I've been thinking a bit about creating legacy renderer which would use just fixed function pipeline and not any fancy features for older or slow integrated cards. But it would mean I would have to support two very different renderers and I would have to think about how to create any new effect in both renderers. This would be too much effort for very little gain since even pretty old cards can do decent shaders.
I understand your position but I thought you would "simply" not implement some fancy effects on old hardwares in order to have one main high-end renderer and a worse renderer with less features, not 2 full renderers. For example, my graphics card has no pixel shader and crappy vertex shader, I expected from having no fancy effects but something playable. I know making a FPS requires a lot of energy, I understand that you prefer not investing any time to create a legacy renderer.

What about using Java Web Start?

Offline jezek2
« Reply #48 - Posted 2009-11-25 19:57:28 »

I understand your position but I thought you would "simply" not implement some fancy effects on old hardwares in order to have one main high-end renderer and a worse renderer with less features, not 2 full renderers. For example, my graphics card has no pixel shader and crappy vertex shader, I expected from having no fancy effects but something playable. I know making a FPS requires a lot of energy, I understand that you prefer not investing any time to create a legacy renderer.

Shaders are not simply effects, it's completely different way of doing things. They're part of the engine renderer, not just some optional artist created effects. This is common misconception.

I would have no way to eg. implement volumetric smoke without shaders, but I really need this effect for gameplay. I would have to use many sprites for the legacy renderer. It would behave differently (poorly) and would be misused to take advantage in network play.

What about using Java Web Start?

Not possible for this game. There are many problems with WebStart:

1) it's unreliable
2) it's alien concept to users
3) it can't handle big apps well (like 0.5GB and more), the cache is limited to 1GB at maximum
4) doesn't have support for mirrors
5) uninstalls are very poor and impossible to hook own uninstall script (even if it's theoretically possible)
6) needs Java installed
7) not so nice UI
...
Offline DzzD
« Reply #49 - Posted 2009-11-25 20:04:21 »

Also someone with Radeon X700 would be helpful too (or any other Radeon card with PS 2.0b).
dont know if it may help but I  got a x800 ? do y like me to test with ?

Offline jezek2
« Reply #50 - Posted 2009-11-25 20:11:33 »

dont know if it may help but I  got a x800 ? do y like me to test with ?

Yes, that should be very similar to X700 (has also PS2.0b).
Offline DzzD
« Reply #51 - Posted 2009-11-25 20:22:01 »

hum.. dont know if it come from the graphics card but I got a system error on javaw.exe (see enclosed image) when it goes fullscreen.

the game did not start : show loading popup  then just flash as if it go fullscreen and popup the error below.

Offline gouessej
« Reply #52 - Posted 2009-11-25 23:33:11 »

Shaders are not simply effects, it's completely different way of doing things. They're part of the engine renderer, not just some optional artist created effects. This is common misconception.
Sorry I assumed you used only pixel shaders for some light effects. Actually, you don't use the fixed pipeline.

Not possible for this game. There are many problems with WebStart:

1) it's unreliable
2) it's alien concept to users
3) it can't handle big apps well (like 0.5GB and more), the cache is limited to 1GB at maximum
4) doesn't have support for mirrors
5) uninstalls are very poor and impossible to hook own uninstall script (even if it's theoretically possible)
6) needs Java installed
7) not so nice UI
...
I suggested this only for the demo, not for the whole project. I would advise you to use IzPack rather than Java Web Start for the final release, it is very clean, stable and professional.

Offline jezek2
« Reply #53 - Posted 2009-11-26 00:10:00 »

hum.. dont know if it come from the graphics card but I got a system error on javaw.exe (see enclosed image) when it goes fullscreen.

the game did not start : show loading popup  then just flash as if it go fullscreen and popup the error below.

Thanks, can you send me also the log? It's in "logs/resforce.0.txt".
Offline DzzD
« Reply #54 - Posted 2009-11-26 00:17:12 »

Thanks, can you send me also the log? It's in "logs/resforce.0.txt".

here it is (3 attempts)

Offline SimonH
« Reply #55 - Posted 2009-11-26 01:13:49 »

1  
2  
 [error] unhandled exception occurred in thread "main"
             [...] org.lwjgl.LWJGLException: Pixel format not accelerated

67MB is a lot to download for an error - maybe it would be kinder to use a preloader?
While I'm here, isn't including the whole JRE a bit heavy? A quick version check could save a lot of user pain!

People make games and games make people
Offline jezek2
« Reply #56 - Posted 2009-11-26 01:59:23 »

1  
2  
 [error] unhandled exception occurred in thread "main"
             [...] org.lwjgl.LWJGLException: Pixel format not accelerated


Thanks for test, can you send me the whole log?

67MB is a lot to download for an error - maybe it would be kinder to use a preloader?
While I'm here, isn't including the whole JRE a bit heavy? A quick version check could save a lot of user pain!

The final version will be like 0.5GB big or so. JRE will be just a tiny fraction of the total size. One of the point of alpha version is to test in final configuration.

here it is (3 attempts)

Thanks, this is already known bug. Once I fix it I'll ask you to try again.
Offline jezek2
« Reply #57 - Posted 2009-11-26 02:33:15 »

I've added Mac OS X version of the game. You can download it here:

resforce-alpha.dmg [49MB]

Currently all settings, screenshots and logs are stored directly in the application bundle. You can view the content by right clicking on it, choosing "Show Package Contents" and then navigate to Contents and Resources folders.
Offline CommanderKeith
« Reply #58 - Posted 2009-11-27 05:25:58 »

This game rocks, congratulations for finishing it, it's just like counterstrike. Very clean and crisp graphics and movement.

My FPS was 58-80 on a dual core vista with a Nvidia GEFORCE 8600M GT.

The way the bots die and fall down is great, as are the body shadows. There's a fair amount of vertical retrace choppyness when you strafe, but I suppose that's because you aren't yet sync'ing the frame rate to the screen refresh so you can better test performance?

The menus are nice and minimal. Having to be connected to the internet to play isn't so good I think. Some good bot AI and more weapons would be awesome. I noticed that you can run with shift and aim with right click, can you also duck?

Great work  Cool


Offline jezek2
« Reply #59 - Posted 2009-11-27 06:10:43 »

This game rocks, congratulations for finishing it, it's just like counterstrike. Very clean and crisp graphics and movement.

My FPS was 58-80 on a dual core vista with a Nvidia GEFORCE 8600M GT.

Thanks. Yeah there was a lot of work needed to finish the playable alpha version. Over the time I've incrementally moved half of the items in TODO required for first public alpha to post-release time (including many optimizations). But finishing playable game means that every important feature is there so I can now focus on adding new features and enhancing existing stuff without much problem Smiley

The way the bots die and fall down is great, as are the body shadows. There's a fair amount of vertical retrace choppyness when you strafe, but I suppose that's because you aren't yet sync'ing the frame rate to the screen refresh so you can better test performance?

Yes, I'll add both vsync and FPS limiter with user choosen limit. The problem with vsync is that it increases input lag and there can be frequent changing from 30 to 60 FPS when the FPS is varying over the edge (this could be fixed by applying FPS limiter to eg. 50 FPS max so the vsync would always end up with 30 FPS). Some players prefer to use it, others not. The tearing is different for each monitor type, eg. on my CRT monitor it's practically not noticeable and there are many types of LCD too. Also some users are more sensitive to it than others.

The menus are nice and minimal. Having to be connected to the internet to play isn't so good I think. Some good bot AI and more weapons would be awesome. I noticed that you can run with shift and aim with right click, can you also duck?

This game is multiplayer only, there is no plan to add bots. The existing bot is used only for developing when I need test some features that can't be tested with just one player. More weapons will be added in subsequent updates. You can check all available actions in Options -> Controls.
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