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  low level multipass rendering  (Read 2912 times)
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Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Posted 2006-09-21 01:43:12 »

Hah!!! It's done. We have real low level multipass rendering now. Grin

The MultiPassView has disused. I've set it deprecated as well as org.xith3d.render.multipass.RenderPass. Please see org.xith3d.test.render.MultipassTest(2).

The multipass rendering works without any bufferswapping suppression or buffer clearing. It doesn't even loose the stencil buffer in layered mode. The work is done inside the OpenGL rendering and saves time by not doing the whole rendering code for all passes but only the differing one. The opengl frame initialisation (don't know how expensive) is done only for each frame, but not for each frame and pass.

And this is how it goes:
  • Create and instance of BranchGroup and pass either to the constructor or to the appropriate setter an instance of com.xith3d.render.RenderPassConfigProvider, which can be e.g. com.xith3d.render.RenderPassConfig and set the properties if it.
  • Create as much more BranchGroups as you like and handle them alike
  • Add these BranchGroups to the Locale instance, just as you already know it.
  • Set the property universe.getRenderer().setLayeredMode(boolean) to what ever you like. The default is false regulary, since people shouldn't get a different rendering behaviour when they've existing code with multiple BranchGroups in a Locale. When you're using Xith3DEnvironment, the default is automatically set to true.

Should be most easy. Smiley

BranchGroups that don't hold an instance of com.xith3d.render.RenderPassConfigProvider don't effect the rendering and the values are taken from the View.

Well, this shoud give us a (small) performance boost. Tomorrow I'll check, if we can get rid of this every-frame-RenderBins-refilling problem. I think, we can modify the RenderBins only when a modification on the scenegraph was made. No need to traverse the whole scenegraph every frame. This should give a really bug performance boost. Grin


Cheers,
Marvin
Offline bohdan

Junior Devvie




Java-positive...


« Reply #1 - Posted 2006-09-21 08:34:57 »

Great work Amos! Sounds very interesting to me, looking forward to give it a try!
I think, we can modify the RenderBins only when a modification on the scenegraph was made. No need to traverse the whole scenegraph every frame. This should give a really bug performance boost. Grin
Yep, I thinks this thing was one of the main disadvantage of xith so far in comparison to Java3D and jME... So, good luck!!!  Grin

Bohdan.
Offline cylab

JGO Ninja


Medals: 55



« Reply #2 - Posted 2006-09-21 08:48:58 »

Good Job!!!  Grin

I am looking forward to discuss the concrete changes you have in mind, so we could all get a deeper insight in the current and future rendering code.

And... don't go away before all changes are fully documented and reflected in the getting started guide or nobody will ever be able to further maintain the code base  Shocked Tongue Wink

Mathias - I Know What [you] Did Last Summer!
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #3 - Posted 2006-09-21 09:30:09 »

Great work Amos! Sounds very interesting to me, looking forward to give it a try!

Well, thanks. But I'm not Amos. Wink

I am looking forward to discuss the concrete changes you have in mind, so we could all get a deeper insight in the current and future rendering code.

I'll happily answer questions Smiley.

And... don't go away before all changes are fully documented and reflected in the getting started guide or nobody will ever be able to further maintain the code base  Shocked Tongue Wink

Well, I' won't update the getting started guide. But the changes will certainly be reflected in XIN, shich you can hopefully download from xith.org (currently only CVS). And I won't go away too soon Wink

Marvin
Offline bohdan

Junior Devvie




Java-positive...


« Reply #4 - Posted 2006-09-21 09:33:50 »

Well, thanks. But I'm not Amos. Wink
I'm sorry, Marvin, always mixing up you two  Grin
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #5 - Posted 2006-09-21 09:42:01 »

I'm sorry, Marvin, always mixing up you two  Grin

No problem Wink. Sometimes I was wondering, if I could in any way change the name of my nick in the boards. Maybe a moderator could do this for me. Then I would in some way write my real name into the account. (And Amos could remove this really long MagicSparc.org string WinkWinkWink and add his real name, too).
Offline bohdan

Junior Devvie




Java-positive...


« Reply #6 - Posted 2006-09-21 09:54:21 »

No problem Wink. Sometimes I was wondering, if I could in any way change the name of my nick in the boards. Maybe a moderator could do this for me. Then I would in some way write my real name into the account. (And Amos could remove this really long MagicSparc.org string WinkWinkWink and add his real name, too).
It would be good thing to do, probably. For me the bigets confusion is too strong association "Qudus<->Amos", just sounds to me  Grin Grin
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #7 - Posted 2006-09-21 10:07:05 »

...For me the bigets confusion is too strong association "Qudus<->Amos", just sounds to me  Grin Grin

Well, ok. It is a little similar Smiley.

Always remember:
Amos = Amos Wenger = BlueSky = <MagicSpark.org [ BlueSky ]>
Marvin = Marvin Fröhlich = Marvin Froehlich = Qudus

Does this sound rememberable? Grin

Marvin
Offline cylab

JGO Ninja


Medals: 55



« Reply #8 - Posted 2006-09-21 10:50:03 »

I'll happily answer questions Smiley.
I bet Grin but it might be good to discuss things _before_ you change something, so we all get a feeling (and voice) in where things heading... just a thought, I certainly don't want to slow you down Wink since I am very gladfull to see someone actually being motivated to get things done! (and not _only_ discuss about it, like myself most of the time Embarrassed)

Well, I' won't update the getting started guide.
Well, I think updating the GSG to be accurate and to contain working examples of all major features is very important, so I will have to jump in and take this task myself Shocked

Well, I' won't update the getting started guide. But the changes will certainly be reflected in XIN, shich you can hopefully download from xith.org (currently only CVS). And I won't go away too soon Wink
XIN?

Edit - just to answer myself "Xith In Nutshell" in xith-tk docs...

Mathias - I Know What [you] Did Last Summer!
Offline bohdan

Junior Devvie




Java-positive...


« Reply #9 - Posted 2006-09-21 11:47:14 »

Always remember:
Amos = Amos Wenger = BlueSky = <MagicSpark.org [ BlueSky ]>
Marvin = Marvin Fröhlich = Marvin Froehlich = Qudus

Does this sound rememberable? Grin
No, Qudus <=> Amos is still better  Grin Grin Grin Grin   ...joking, that's fine, thanks for cross-references  Grin
Games published by our own members! Check 'em out!
Legends of Yore - The Casual Retro Roguelike
Offline Amos Wenger

Senior Devvie




Everything's possible, but not everything's fun...


« Reply #10 - Posted 2006-09-21 16:23:27 »

I think, we can modify the RenderBins only when a modification on the scenegraph was made. No need to traverse the whole scenegraph every frame. This should give a really bug performance boost. Grin
Yep, I thinks this thing was one of the main disadvantage of xith so far in comparison to Java3D and jME... So, good luck!!!  Grin
Seems great, do you want help or at least can you explain what is really going to be changed ? And if a node is moved on the scenegraph, will the renderbin(s) be destroyed and recreated or will it be reused ? What *is* exactly a RenderBin ? If my idea on renderbins is right how costly it is to translate a node into a RenderBin ?

I am looking forward to discuss the concrete changes you have in mind, so we could all get a deeper insight in the current and future rendering code.
+1

And... don't go away before all changes are fully documented and reflected in the getting started guide or nobody will ever be able to further maintain the code base  Shocked Tongue Wink
Be reassured, I'm watching what Qudus is doing...  Cool

I'm sorry, Marvin, always mixing up you two  Grin
I thought you could differentiate "the man who said he's working on something" (Amos) and "the guy who say that yesterday he rewrote half the engine" (Qudus).

No problem Wink. Sometimes I was wondering, if I could in any way change the name of my nick in the boards. Maybe a moderator could do this for me. Then I would in some way write my real name into the account. (And Amos could remove this really long MagicSparc.org string WinkWinkWink and add his real name, too).
Well we could PM to ChrisM.. But I already changed my pseudonym in the past so I'll hope it won't annoy him. Anyway I'll tell him to do so (for me. I don't know if you want "Marvin" or "Marvin Froehlich". The latter reduce the risk of confusing you with a well-known martian).

"Once you start working on something, don't be afraid of failure and don't abandon it. People who work sincerely are the happiest"
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #11 - Posted 2006-09-21 17:26:47 »

I'll happily answer questions Smiley.
I bet Grin but it might be good to discuss things _before_ you change something, so we all get a feeling (and voice) in where things heading... just a thought, I certainly don't want to slow you down Wink since I am very gladfull to see someone actually being motivated to get things done! (and not _only_ discuss about it, like myself most of the time Embarrassed)

Well, sometimes, when I find it helpful for the whole thing, I've ever asked before. But in this case, I was just lingering through the rendering source trying to understand it and found something here and there that could be changed. It was becomeing more and more and finally I had modified the whole thing so that it is more logical in every concern. And since nobody (active) in the forum seems to exactly know, what's going on behind the curtains, I found it useless to ask. Sorry if that's false Wink.

EDIT: No offense. But that's what people say themselves. Before I wandered through the rendering code I had to say it for myself, too. Now I can say, that I have a qute good idea of what's going on Smiley

Well, I' won't update the getting started guide.
Well, I think updating the GSG to be accurate and to contain working examples of all major features is very important, so I will have to jump in and take this task myself Shocked

You don't need to update the GSG, since XIN totally replaces it. When it's completely ready it will take the place of GSG on xith.org.

Marvin
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #12 - Posted 2006-09-21 17:47:29 »

Well we could PM to ChrisM.. But I already changed my pseudonym in the past so I'll hope it won't annoy him. Anyway I'll tell him to do so (for me. I don't know if you want "Marvin" or "Marvin Froehlich". The latter reduce the risk of confusing you with a well-known martian).

If thought a lot about that. On the one hand I'm (well) known by the nick "Qudus". So changing the name would confuse the one or the other. On the other hand I realized some months ago, that this community is not that annonyme like others, which I like very much Smiley. So changing the name to my real name isn't bad. But I don't want my full name to be displayed in the forums. Not that nobody should see it (most people here do know it), but I think taking a short name is much more practical. So "Marvin" is better on this hand. But I don't want to loose the link to my nick. So I think the best compromise would be to change the displayed name to "Marvin (Qudus)", which isn't too short but will be ok.

Will you PM ChrisM or should I do it?

Marvin
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #13 - Posted 2006-09-21 18:23:07 »

Seems great, do you want help...

Thank you very much for the offer. But not in this case. I first need to check how this can be done. Well, I have an imagination of it and I've prepared the base for it during the last changes.
Please don't be annoyed. I don't mean to offend you. But aren't there enough points on the list to be done?

...or at least can you explain what is really going to be changed ? And if a node is moved on the scenegraph, will the renderbin(s) be destroyed and recreated or will it be reused ? What *is* exactly a RenderBin ? If my idea on renderbins is right how costly it is to translate a node into a RenderBin ?

Please read further in this thread.

Marvin
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #14 - Posted 2006-09-21 19:15:03 »

Well we could PM to ChrisM.. But I already changed my pseudonym in the past so I'll hope it won't annoy him. Anyway I'll tell him to do so (for me. I don't know if you want "Marvin" or "Marvin Froehlich". The latter reduce the risk of confusing you with a well-known martian).

If thought a lot about that. On the one hand I'm (well) known by the nick "Qudus". So changing the name would confuse the one or the other. On the other hand I realized some months ago, that this community is not that annonyme like others, which I like very much Smiley. So changing the name to my real name isn't bad. But I don't want my full name to be displayed in the forums. Not that nobody should see it (most people here do know it), but I think taking a short name is much more practical. So "Marvin" is better on this hand. But I don't want to loose the link to my nick. So I think the best compromise would be to change the displayed name to "Marvin (Qudus)", which isn't too short but will be ok.

Will you PM ChrisM or should I do it?

Marvin

Well, I rethought it Grin. "Marvin Fröhlich" is better. Whould be good to have it "Marvin Fröhlich" and not "Marvin Froehlich", which should be no problem in HTML Wink.

I see you've already got a name change. How did you do it? Did you PM ChrisM?
Offline Amos Wenger

Senior Devvie




Everything's possible, but not everything's fun...


« Reply #15 - Posted 2006-09-22 14:44:38 »

Well we could PM to ChrisM.. But I already changed my pseudonym in the past so I'll hope it won't annoy him. Anyway I'll tell him to do so (for me. I don't know if you want "Marvin" or "Marvin Froehlich". The latter reduce the risk of confusing you with a well-known martian).

If thought a lot about that. On the one hand I'm (well) known by the nick "Qudus". So changing the name would confuse the one or the other. On the other hand I realized some months ago, that this community is not that annonyme like others, which I like very much Smiley. So changing the name to my real name isn't bad. But I don't want my full name to be displayed in the forums. Not that nobody should see it (most people here do know it), but I think taking a short name is much more practical. So "Marvin" is better on this hand. But I don't want to loose the link to my nick. So I think the best compromise would be to change the displayed name to "Marvin (Qudus)", which isn't too short but will be ok.

Will you PM ChrisM or should I do it?

Marvin

Well, I rethought it Grin. "Marvin Fröhlich" is better. Whould be good to have it "Marvin Fröhlich" and not "Marvin Froehlich", which should be no problem in HTML Wink.

I see you've already got a name change. How did you do it? Did you PM ChrisM?
Yes indeed.
The most easy place to have a link to its profile is in the LevelUp Vodcast Section.

"Once you start working on something, don't be afraid of failure and don't abandon it. People who work sincerely are the happiest"
Offline Marvin Fröhlich

Senior Devvie




May the 4th, be with you...


« Reply #16 - Posted 2006-09-22 18:55:39 »

The most easy place to have a link to its profile is in the LevelUp Vodcast Section.

What is that Huh
Offline Amos Wenger

Senior Devvie




Everything's possible, but not everything's fun...


« Reply #17 - Posted 2006-09-23 09:38:29 »

The most easy place to have a link to its profile is in the LevelUp Vodcast Section.

What is that Huh
http://www.java-gaming.org/forums/index.php?board=54.0

"Once you start working on something, don't be afraid of failure and don't abandon it. People who work sincerely are the happiest"
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