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1  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Mac App Store without Java on: 2010-10-26 01:08:42
I understand why some might be interested in supporting Apple stuff for business reasons, but other than that, who cares.

Apple is a disgusting company that has already demonstrated that their idea of a "computer" is a locked down appliance. Removing Java is just another step to lock it down further.

I don't know why some people are shocked. You should have seen this coming a long time ago.

Apple is worse than Microsoft. I never understood why some Java developers seemed to like Macs so much.
2  Discussions / Miscellaneous Topics / Re: John Carmack QuakeCon 09 Keynote on: 2009-08-20 18:22:46
Not sure why people take him so seriously. He is a graphics programmer and nothing more. He is not a programming language designer, he is not an operating system designer, etc. There's plenty he doesn't know.

The only things you might be interested to hear from him is either graphics or business related things. That's it.
3  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Another language feature I'd like on: 2009-07-08 18:28:00
I submit that "macros" might just be another way of saying "compiler plugins". I also suspect compiler plugins would be more flexible, delegating as they would the compilation of particular bits of text to a completely separate compiler. Possibly.

Cas Smiley

No, macros are a language feature, just like functions, where you can generate different code sequences based on parameters received from the macro call. With the option of nesting parameter lists, so you can have entire trees of data to play with and generate the correct code.

This way you would be able to create a "select" call yourself and it would be compiled into the usual JDBC calls you always need to do. It wouldn't be a function invocation, it would be just that you would write the code the way you want to do it, like a shortcut syntax, and the language would handle the generation of the code for that.
4  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Another language feature I'd like on: 2009-07-08 18:21:49
You language ****s never change! Which is why Java's stuck in the mid-90s still, where it started. I'm fed up of how much boilerplate crap I have to do to get simple things done, and I'd love a way forward to add to Java that had sod all effect on anyone who didn't care. So a plugin architecture for javac would be brilliant, because Orangytang wouldn't have to care about maintaining Java code - because it won't be Java code, it'll be base Java + SQL-over-collections-plugin code, and if that becomes some sort of standard plugin, then he'll learn it.

I wish Java would be stuck in the 50s, right when Lisp came to be. And I wish were a Lisp dialect. Then all the problems cited by you and others wouldn't exist.

Java doesn't need to copy C#, Java needs to go back in time and learn how to do it right.
5  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Another language feature I'd like on: 2009-07-08 18:12:49
I'm kind of shocked that nobody has come out against the crowd and agreed with you yet, Cas - your example requires far fewer keystrokes, is more understandable, and omits all the crap boilerplate that makes maintaining and extending most Java code a nightmare.  I don't see what's not to like, except that it's different from the way things are done now.

We don't need more crappy syntax to complicate things even further. We need macros. A much more intelligent way of dealing with such problems.
6  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Another language feature I'd like on: 2009-07-08 18:08:17
Set operations are just such a fundamental way of dealing with data I wonder why they haven't been integrated into proper languages much sooner.

Cas Smiley

Some people have been doing whatever they want in programming languages using a feature called "macros" present in Lisp languages since the 60s. Everything would be much easier, not just this example, if Java had macros.

I wonder why people insist in creating special syntax for whatever little BS they can think of if they could just write macros! And I wonder why in 40 years nobody ever thought about copying such a valuable feature from Lisp.

I mean, in the 70s and 80s you would have some justification for using languages lacking in features and that look and write like vomit, like C for example, but for God's sake, we have gigabytes of RAM and multicore processors now. There's no excuse. It is simply idiotic.

It is not just Java, it is most languages out there. C# is a mess and LINQ is just a workaround for the sheer stupidity of programming language designers.
7  Discussions / Miscellaneous Topics / Re: Java VS Mono ==> Java is d00med on: 2009-06-28 01:46:48
couldnt we make a mono wrapper to load jvm stuff Cheesy

And get sued by Microsoft if by any chance it actually gets used? No, thanks. They have this videogame business going on, and if you actually get to be a perceived threat, even if only potential and not a real threat, they will do anything to stop you.

Using Mono is asking to get raped. Do you really think they would let something like that on competing platforms such as the PS3?
8  Discussions / Miscellaneous Topics / Re: Java VS Mono ==> Java is d00med on: 2009-06-26 19:16:10
I read this thread some time ago and I had some laughs.

When was Java a real contender in the gaming industry? Never. Very few people actually use it. And it is not like the game industry is wanting it desperately. As a matter of fact, the initial hype surrounding Java and its slowness have forever scarred it for game developers, even if today things aren't like that anymore.

So how is it any different than what was before? Sun isn't a game company, then don't expect them to do anything for Java in that department besides some useful libraries like JOGL bindings and whatnot. Especially now with the open source JDK.

Microsoft can try to push C# in their Visual Studio, but even then C++ is still the standard, especially because of the speed and portability to other platforms. So, how is this "good news" for C#? Just because someone is building a version of some engine that nobody will ever use for real things?

If some people really want to see Java used in games then they must pull a Steve Jobs and just do it.
9  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Question about Animator on: 2009-06-24 04:26:58
Hi, how can the Animator class call the GLAutoDrawable display method? Shouldn't AWT event dispatch thread automatically do it? What happens then? Is it called twice, once with AWT and another manually?
10  Discussions / Miscellaneous Topics / Re: Defending Java over a developer's decision on: 2006-07-05 04:28:08
I am sure it will be used as "proof" by the "Java is slow" crowd.
11  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / question on text color on: 2006-05-10 02:38:36
Hi,

I am using to Java2D for drawing some string to a texture and then using it in a quad:

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      GlyphVector glyph = text.font.createGlyphVector(new FontRenderContext(
            null, true, true), text.string);

                BufferedImage image = new BufferedImage((int) text.width, (int) text.height,
            BufferedImage.TYPE_4BYTE_ABGR);
      Graphics2D java2d = (Graphics2D) image.getGraphics();
      java2d.setFont(text.font);
      java2d.setPaint(text.color);
      java2d.drawGlyphVector(glyph, text.x, (int) (text.y + text.height));


But the text always appear as black. The value of the color above is like this:

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      color = new Color(0.9f, 0.9f, 0.9f, 1.0f);


What could be wrong that makes the text always appear as black?
12  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Phong shading on: 2006-05-01 01:32:52
Hi,

Does any one know any good resource for this?

The xml below is from a collada file, I am searching for information on how exactly use it in OpenGL.

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               <phong>
                  <emission>
                     <color>1.0 0.0 0.0 1.0</color>
                  </emission>
                  <ambient>
                     <color>1.0 0.0 0.0 1.0</color>
                  </ambient>
                  <diffuse>
                     <color>1.0 0.0 0.0 1.0</color>
                  </diffuse>
                  <specular>
                     <color>1.0 0.0 0.0 1.0</color>
                  </specular>
                  <shininess>
                     <float>20.0</float>
                  </shininess>
                  <reflective>
                     <color>1.0 0.0 0.0 1.0</color>
                  </reflective>
                  <reflectivity>
                     <float>0.5</float>
                  </reflectivity>
                  <transparent>
                     <color>1.0 0.0 0.0 1.0</color>
                  </transparent>
                  <transparency>
                     <float>1.0</float>
                  </transparency>
               </phong>
13  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Re: Truetype fonts on: 2006-04-28 01:12:34
I ran the webstart file, it worked, but where's the source?
14  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Re: VBOs on: 2006-04-27 03:00:49
I found where the problem is, it's related to the view and camera code, if I put a value in lookAt manually it shows the cube. I'm going to debug it tomorrow.

Yes, it seems VBO is working fine. Thanks.
15  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Re: VBOs on: 2006-04-26 23:57:46
1 cube = 6 sides = 6 polygons

16  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Re: VBOs on: 2006-04-26 12:11:12
This is just sample data that draws a cube. I won't really use polygons when I start loading my own models.
17  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Re: Truetype fonts on: 2006-04-26 03:49:32
I own the red book (3rd ed) and didn't know there were Truetype code in there. Is there any? I'm not really trying to learn glBegin and glEnd, just want a pointer to somewhere with relevant information on Truetype, Java and jogl
18  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / VBOs on: 2006-04-26 03:45:43
Ok, I already searched past topics in here and took a look at the jogl demos source for vertex buffer objects but I have a few questions  because I couldn't make it work yet.

I'm not sure if the following code is correct:

- Is this correct?

The first time it reaches the geometry it sets the buffer:

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         int numVertices = poly.getVertices().size();
         int numNormals = poly.getNormals().size();

         FloatBuffer vertices = BufferUtil.newFloatBuffer(numVertices * 3);
         FloatBuffer normals = BufferUtil.newFloatBuffer(numNormals * 3);

         for (int i = 0; i < numVertices; i++) {
            Vector3f vertex = poly.getVertices().get(i);
            vertices.put(vertex.x);
            vertices.put(vertex.y);
            vertices.put(vertex.z);
         }

         for (int i = 0; i < numNormals; i++) {
            Vector3f normal = poly.getNormals().get(i);
            normals.put(normal.x);
            normals.put(normal.y);
            normals.put(normal.z);
         }

         vertices.flip();
         normals.flip();

         int[] ids = new int[2];
         gl.glGenBuffersARB(2, ids, 0);
         gl.glBindBufferARB(GL_ARRAY_BUFFER_ARB, ids[0]);
         gl.glBufferDataARB(GL_ARRAY_BUFFER_ARB, vertices.capacity() * 4,
               vertices, GL_STATIC_DRAW_ARB);
         poly.setVertexBufferId(ids[0]);

         gl.glBindBufferARB(GL_ARRAY_BUFFER_ARB, ids[1]);
         gl.glBufferDataARB(GL_ARRAY_BUFFER_ARB, normals.capacity() * 4,
               normals, GL_STATIC_DRAW_ARB);
         poly.setNormalBufferId(ids[1]);


The next times it just binds the buffer and draws the arrays:

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         gl.glBindBufferARB(GL_ARRAY_BUFFER_ARB, poly.getVertexBufferId());
         gl.glVertexPointer(3, GL_FLOAT, 0, 0);

         gl.glBindBufferARB(GL_ARRAY_BUFFER_ARB, poly.getNormalBufferId());
         gl.glNormalPointer(GL_FLOAT, 0, 0);

         gl.glDrawArrays(GL_POLYGON, 0, poly.getVertices().size());


- Why in the jogl demos glMapBuffer is used? Is this really needed?

19  Java Game APIs & Engines / JOGL Development / Truetype fonts on: 2006-04-26 02:01:19
Hi,

I would like to know if there's a library that prints text using truetype fonts with jogl, or at least a way of doing it with jogl myself.
20  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Missing some C++ features in Java on: 2006-03-19 19:46:13
- real templates (the java generics stuff is really just useful for collections)

Maybe I'm being "too creative" here but I think we can do more with Generics than Collections, for example:

I have an interface:

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public interface Handler<T extends Something> {
    void handle(T something);
}


Then create a class like:

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public CarHandler implements Handler<Car> {
    public void handle(Car car) {
      // do something.
    }
}


If I used an interface instead of Generics I wouldn't be able to access the fields and other methods not specified in the interface without a Cast, and then bad things could happen.


21  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Missing some C++ features in Java on: 2006-03-19 03:16:23
I didn't understand your text, sorry.

I was criticizing typedef and I think it's bad. The classes should have meaningful enough names and not need sinonyms.
22  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Missing some C++ features in Java on: 2006-03-19 02:13:04
I have yet to understand how adding "sinonyms" to classes would help. If I have a "HashMap<Node, Node>" would it be better to know right away that it's a HashMap than find something like "Arc"? What's "Arc"? Is it a class, I don't find it in any package!? Where is it defined? Oh wait, a very intelligent developer called a HashMap an Arc.

I think this is a bug not a feature. Once I confronted a Python developer about this, Python has something similar, he told me that the "IDE would facilitate things". That's funny.

When it comes to bash Java then IDEs don't count, comparing isolated features is ok. When things get ugly for them then the IDE matters! Smiley
23  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Why C# teams try to port C++ engines to pure C# quite often(?), but Java dont? on: 2006-03-15 18:27:21
I don't recall saying it was news, but if we're discussing the relative merits of C# one of them is that Asp.net is a pleasure to develop with and I haven't used any equivalent jsp solutions- they may exist, but very few ISPs offer java hosting and most of them offer windows hosting.

I don't recall saying that C# was bad. But now that you touched the subject I have to say that you were probably using the wrong tools when developed in Java. That would explain it.

Quote
If you haven't used Rails though you really can't comment on it - firstly it's based on a very powerful and expressive language and secondly it does so much of the routine stuff for you automatically, all the things that you end up doing for every project are just done, right there, when you show it your database. Its nothing that couldn't have been done by anyone but it is the first time I've seen it done in one place by a basic platform.  There is a lot of Rails hype at the moment, but there genuinely is a nugget of gold at the heart of it.

I try to be broadly language-agnostic, but Ruby has really impressed me.

Ok, you didn't say that "Ruby is designed for happiness" in your standard believer preach. Hehehe Sorry, I couldn't resist.  Smiley

I don't recall saying that Rails was bad, but cheap CRUD webapps are not new  and I showed that much of the "ease" was already performed by other languages such as PHP.

As far as I know PHP is (was?) the language of cheap CRUD webapps, the area where Rails shine, J2EE is not there. So the competitor of Rails is PHP not Java.

24  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Why C# teams try to port C++ engines to pure C# quite often(?), but Java don on: 2006-03-15 18:11:49
Still, creating a java game engine does not mean to close eyes. Borrowing bits here and there from opensource C++/xyz language engine does pay off and speed implementation phase. I presume its perfectly valid to borrow code crosslanguage if license models match.

I believe "borrow" is quite different than "porting".

I wish we had these three options in Java:
* delegate instead of anonymous classes for listener pattern
* true properties, not just getXXXX/setXXX naming convention "properties"
* struct object (use this http://bugs.sun.com/bugdatabase/view_bug.do?bug_id=4820062 page to read pros+cons+feelings)
* operator overloading (see how annoying BigInteger is for business math apps)

First two of which Anders "The Delphi Man" Helsberg tried to bring Java, but was rejected.

I'm not going to argue that those ideas are "bad" because we get addicted to such things (generics are really good), but...

I think people put WAY TOO MUCH importance and little syntactic sugar details. Such things (your specific cited things) won't make a difference in the big picture! And some could even cause more harm than good! What's the point!?

People should compare platforms in terms of needs (your needs) and the perspective the platform gives. I'd hate to see Java becoming like Perl! Ten ways to do the same thing.

PS.: Java doesn't  force you to use get/set for everything. And I have noticed that several Java programmers have the (bad) habit of creating a thousand Java Bean classes for exclusively holding data without even thinking. Maybe what we need is not a "property" keyword but a deintoxication clinic for Java Beans addicts.

An example of "how things can go bad" is when I was experimenting XMLBeans for parsing a big XML file. Ok, the tool is fine and it works, but I ended with gazillion classes with get/set !! That was nuts! The good and old DOM would do the job with far less code, writing code using DOM would be less trouble than using 1000 automatically generated classes.
25  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Why C# teams try to port C++ engines to pure C# quite often(?), but Java dont? on: 2006-03-15 17:48:01
For web development Asp.net is easier to work than J2EE and for most work that I do J2EE would be a sledgehammer to crack a nut, but again that is an irrelevance cos Rails is going to sweep the board on that front over the next few years.

Surely cheap CRUD webapps are easier to do in a lot of places outside J2EE. Just take a look the number PHP sites out there, I fail to see how this is "news" and how Rails will do any better than PHP and other scripting languages.

And I used PHP before coming to Java, mostly for opensource hype, and it's an experience I'd rather forget.
26  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Why C# teams try to port C++ engines to pure C# quite often(?), but Java don on: 2006-03-14 21:13:00
Java is great and I use Java daily basis. I want to use it for every aspect of programming. But boring business part and corporation projects force me to study C#/asp.net technology. I have managed to avoid any project assignents so far, but my luck is running low every week :-( :-(

Is it my impression or there's a sense of inevitability in some posts lately? In an old job I also got forced to learn C#, the solution was: I got a better job in a better company to work with Java all day long (and Perl, nothing is perfect).
27  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Why C# teams try to port C++ engines to pure C# quite often(?), but Java don on: 2006-03-14 18:04:51
And porting well featured and layered opnesource C++ engine to opensource C# engine seems a good idea. Why invent all from scratch. Porting engine to C# is a lot easier than to Java.

?? A good idea ??
28  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Why C# teams try to port C++ engines to pure C# quite often(?), but Java don on: 2006-03-14 18:02:20
Quote
And porting well featured and layered opnesource C++ engine to opensource C# engine seems a good idea. Why invent all from scratch. Porting engine to C# is a lot easier than to Java.

Why porting instead of writing a decent one in Java taking advantage of the platform's features!?  I understand that the size of the problem (writing an engine from scratch) will be similar, so I can't  just believe why would anyone want to "port" something instead of writing a Java one.

Java has several advantages over statically compiled code that could be used in software like games. It's beyond comprehension why to throw it all away.
29  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: Is there room for another gaming system? on: 2006-03-06 21:43:49
the future of gaming are true consoles and mobile gaming, evo maybe have strong hardware but people would like to choose probably twice chaepier next gen console, becouse they have better specifications (blue-ray ps3, -> abox -? both have hdd and can be used to play dvd-s, hdtv also suported).

You mean the future in US, Europe and Japan only, right?

I live in Brazil and we are largely ignored by Sony and the other companies. For you to have an idea a console that costs US$ 150  in US here it doesn't cost less than U$ 400,00, each game between US$ 150 - US$ 100.  And that's not counting any extra peripherals, memory cards, etc.

That's why the pirates are so happy, they have a very profitable business around here because of Sony and Nintendo practice such crazy prices. Microsoft don't even sell XBox here, let's thank pirates for bringing us the latest titles.

30  Discussions / General Discussions / Re: If you ever wanted a reason to use a modern langauge... on: 2006-02-13 00:37:21
Are you a web application developer and have you developed an application in Ruby /Rails? If not sit down, take a deep breath and pour yourself a lovely hot cup of stfu. The Ruby/Rails combination is by far the smartest development platform I have used in six years of web programming. It's not perfect and there is a learning curve both for the language and the platform, but to dismiss the talk about it as irrational is entirely mistaken. Unlike "Web 2.0" exponents and thier "we're so clever that we're going to call DHTML "AJAX" and make like it's something big and new" approach there is a kernel of undeniable excellence to the Ruby hype.

I didn't say Ruby on Rails was irrational, I said that the Ruby hype is irrational. You can have good frameworks in any language, and that doesn't mean the whole platform is the thing closest to perfection. BTW Ruby is older than Java itself, isn't it curious that some "hype" can influentiate people's opinions all of a sudden?

BTW, are you a web developer and have you used any decent tool for developing software? At least the software I work on is more than a frontend to a database so the "recipe" demonstration won't impress me that much.
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